Who still thinks Silva would beat Bones?

Discussion in 'MMA, Boxing & Other Combat Sports' started by FarooqHakim, Apr 28, 2013.

  1. FarooqHakim

    FarooqHakim Dot Dorbal

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    If Chael was able to close the distance and ragdoll Anderson in their matches, and Jones was able to rag doll Sonnen, what makes it even plausible that Silva would be able to stop that takedown?

    Anderson Silva would have to try to completely stay on the outside, and against Jones, about the best you can hope for is nailing him maybe once like Machida, but that shot was nothing to get too excited about. I mean Silva would not only have to put him out in one shot, but I mean he would need to be cautious about diving right on top of Jones just because he thinks he's hurt.

    I mean Anderson Silva's biggest threat (knees) would be absolutely useless against Jones. Jon can damn near touch the floor standing completely straight. I honestly can only see maybe 5 or 6 HWs having much of a chance to beat Jon Jones as well, and it doesn't look like Jon Jones is having a hard time making 205, he's not even really heavy for the division despite the way he looks.

    Unless of course Anderson Silva figures out Instant Transmission, then I take it back completely.
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  2. zyclon B gas

    zyclon B gas sososerious

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    first, jones would look to strike with silva to "out silva, silva." which we know he can't do. silva arguably has the best, most crisp striking in mma.

    second, anderson most likely isn't gonna get submitted, and he is long and lanky like jones. his bjj is some of the best and he is incredibly comfortable on his back, and jones is still very raw and leaves himself very very open to submissions from the ground a la belfort.


    like i've said though, this is a no-lose situation for silva. if he loses, he's aging and lost to a younger version of him and is still the best p4p since different weight class. if he wins, he's the best p4p.

    he comes out on top no matter what.
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  3. LungZzZ

    LungZzZ Well-Known Member

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    I could see an argument for the GSP ANDERSON super fight still at this point.
    If Jones vs Silva were to happen I don't know who I'd pick yet.
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  4. FarooqHakim

    FarooqHakim Dot Dorbal

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    Who cares if he out Silva's Silva?

    He will more than likely manhandle him to the ground and show us a busted up Anderson Silva face like we've never seen before.

    And again, sure Silva's striking is more "skillful" or "technical" or whatever, just as Frank Mir is a more "skillful" grappler than Brock Lesnar. Machida seemed to have the edge on striking finesse as well, but was he a more effective striker? Not really, Jones dropped him. Athleticism and genetics are often a bigger factor than "skill". If we are assuming for the sake of the argument that Jon Jones isn't at a a smart guy and he tries to go in there and prove he can box with Silva, I just don't think Silva will have enough time to hurt Jon Jones before he abandons that idea and goes back to what should be plan A.

    And I don't honestly think there is a thing Anderson Silva can do when Jones decides he wants the fight on the ground.
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  5. zyclon B gas

    zyclon B gas sososerious

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    i'm not arguing that he could wrestle silva down. he makes weight at 205 and probably walks around at 225-230. silva probably walks around at 185/190-200 at makes 185 no problem, and would be able to make 170 easy. jones isn't making 170 and at 185 would be emaciated. jones has got weight on him all day and his wrestling is really good.

    i'm saying he wrestles him down and silva's guard will pretty much tangle jones up. i wouldn't be surprised if silva got an armbar or triangle on jones without much problem too. jones leaves his wrists wide open all day and all silva needs is a second. possibly you'll bring up sonnen g-n-p'ing silva, but sonnen has no power in his fists. silva will respect jones' power.

    i just don't think it'll be lopsided like you're making it out to be.

    plus, silva's striking defense and clinch are incredible. probably no spinning elbows.
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  6. Brown Recluse

    Brown Recluse Hermit, no crabs

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    I'd give it to Silva based on experience alone...that would be the only deciding factor in the case of a victory by Anderson IMO.
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  7. LungZzZ

    LungZzZ Well-Known Member

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  8. Jay Bee

    Jay Bee Boricua

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    its really up to greg Jackson. if he makes him wrestle he could grind out a win or get submitted. if he actually lets him stand with anderson, he will get put to sleep. fuck his advantages, you don't stand with silva and remain standing.

    I find it amazing that you think the best fighter in UFC history has no chance against Jones. Every time somebody is Anderson's "biggest threat" he destroys them in embarrassing fashion and its like oops.
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  9. FarooqHakim

    FarooqHakim Dot Dorbal

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    @Zyclon, nah Silva walks around at more than that. He only looked small compared to Bonnar and Griffin because those guys are fucking huge 205ers.

    People here or most places on the internet aren't too keen about people cutting a lot of weight, and it might be people's extreme respect for Anderson Silva and disgust for Jon Jones that prevents them from acknowledging this point, but Anderson Silva cuts more weight than Jon Jones to meet the requirements of his division. In terms of body weight percentage, Jon Jones cuts less than Anderson and GSP, probably Jose Aldo, Benson Henderson, Dominick Cruz too.

    Anderson Silva's most underrated skill that I never hear people credit him for is his ability to cut large amounts of weight without that wrestling background (Same with GSP actually). The fact that he still has that ability to fight five rounds in the 185 division at his age for how big he is is fucking insane. In contrast, relative to his division Jon Jones isn't actually that big despite that fact he looks like a giant. Rampage, Forrest, Bonnar, Davis, and probably Tito Ortiz also cut more weight, they just don't have super long arms. Nate Diaz was taller and longer than a lot people at Welterweight, yet he wasn't exactly big for the division. Then look at Anthony Johnson. In terms of limbs and height and width, he didn't appear super big for the Middleweight division, but he was cutting an unrealistic amount weight.

    Not that I think that's bad, because I think if you are willing to put your body through the weight cut, and can manage to still perform less hydrated, then good for you imo.
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  10. FarooqHakim

    FarooqHakim Dot Dorbal

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    The difference is, this new threat obliterated the last new threat who Silva struggled with and is considerably younger than any previous new threat. Okami, Marquardt, Henderson, Sonnen, Vitor, etc. were are very close to being equal despite each one after the next seeming just slightly different enough to maybe make the difference. I think it would be crazy to act like Jon Jones isn't considerably more difficult than anyone Silva has faced. I just don't think Jon will at any point need to prove he's a better striker if he can manage to close the distance against Silva. I think he's just too tall, strong, and athletic for Silva to retain his regular advantages. Silva does have the ability to completely exploit even the smallest error made, and if Jon isn't careful, sure Silva always has a chance to win. He always does.

    Then again, Jones took Sonnen VERY seriously in training, I think people would have thought Jones was fucking stupid if he just came out and stated that his intent was to wrestle Sonnen. It's true that people count Silva out of fights that they shouldn't count him out of, but I think people think Jon Jones can't do a lot of things that he winds up proving he can't do.

    Some of these new guys like Jones, Weidman, Rory, Michael McDonald, etc. seem so driven to outdo the previous generation in all ways it's seriously borderline insane. No wonder this new generation of fighters while spectacular in their fights seem so dry in situations when a mic is in front of them. They are a the athletic equivalent of bunch of nerdy straight A students.
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  11. UnbrokeN

    UnbrokeN Well-Known Member

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    Michael Venom Page would make both of them look like chumps
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  12. Jay Bee

    Jay Bee Boricua

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    I see where u are coming from. jones does beat people up, but he takes their heart away first threw control. silva is a destroyer. imo silva is the favorite until the 5th round is over. jones can try the leg kicks and possibly end up like james Irvin.

    speed,power, etc can never equate to timing and precision
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  13. DethStryque

    DethStryque DethStryque theInvincible

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    It's more than that.

    Chael got destroyed in 1 round vs Jones...but this IS NOT the Chael that fought Anderson. Why? Because after you fight Anderson ONCE...much less TWICE...you are simply NOT the guy you used to be. Period. Anderson takes things you can't replace away from you. That's it that's all.

    Vitor went 4 rounds with Jones, and 1 round with Anderson. Anderson...uninjured...demolished Vitor. Anderson...uninjured...demolished Chael. In comparison of their mutual adversaries, Anderson fares better by far than Jones does for several crucial reasons:

    a) Anderson caught both of these guys when they were LESS battered than when Jones caught them. Jones fought both of these guys AFTER Anderson SMASHED them.

    b.) Anderson fought both of these guys while they were on winning streaks. Anderson snapped both of their winning streaks.

    c.) It's fair to say that if Anderson WASN'T injured, the very first Chael fight would have looked like their rematch. With that in mind, then the combined rounds that Chael and Vitor had against Anderson is 3. Anderson smokes Chael in 2 rounds, Vitor in 1 round. Put another way? Anderson...AT HIS WORST...still EQUALS what Jon AT HIS BEST did vs their mutual adversaries. Vitor and Chael combine for 5 rounds vs both Jon and Anderson, but Chael only did what he did while he was on steroids and against an injured Anderson in their first bout. Vitor did what he did vs Jon AFTER he got smashed vs Anderson. Vitor--post being KO'd by Anderson--nearly submits Jon. Chael--post being dispatched by Anderson in 2 rounds, precisely as Anderson did to Chael's buddy and training partner Dan Henderson--lasts not even a full round vs Jon.

    Anderson wins that comparison, going away.

    Anderson has also faced a broader and deeper array of opposition than Jones has faced, [ not just in MMA but in professional MT and boxing as well ] when Anderson DID NOT HAVE the physical advantages over his opposition that Jones enjoys.

    Anderson has underrated bjj AND underrated wrestling skill. People forget that...even with injured ribs...Anderson took Chael down twice in their first bout, he took down Marquardt, he took down Cote, and he absolutely dominated Hendo, Franklin, Chael and everybody he decided to clinch with via his brutal MMA plumm. Let's not forget that in his most recent bout he took down Stephen Bonnar, too, then finished him. Nobody has finished Bonnar until Anderson did it. And this is Bonnar on roids, mind you...Bonnaroid.

    Anderson is most definitely the better striker of the two. He humbles professional boxers. Jones would do much better vs kickboxing pros than vs boxing pros, whereas Anderson would excel in striking with whomever he chose to strike with.

    Anderson's DEFENSE is BETTER than Jones' defense. There is no way that Vitor would be able to threaten Anderson with that armbar. On the ground, Anderson not only easily eluded Vitor's strikes but he nearly secured Vitor's back in the scramble, and pulled off a sharp knee from the MT clinch. We saw how quickly Anderson dispatched Vitor standing, after easily eluding the blurring combinations that Vitor throws.

    Jones was impressive like he always is, but he didn't do to Vitor what Anderson did.

    Imo Jones is the future of MMA...along with Jordan Burroughs, Mighty Mouse, Aldo, maybe Pettis, and several others I can think of right now and a few besides them who I have my eye on as possible honorable mentions. Like Uriah Hall, Luke Rockhold, Phil Davis, Barboza Jr., Barao, etc.

    But. Anderson is the current G.O.A.T. and deservedly so.

    There it is.
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  14. dodson495

    dodson495 Life is Good

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    silva evades and dodges punches like no other. but besides all the debate jones already said its a lose/lose situation for him because he don't want to lose to him and he doesn't want to be guy to beat him
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  15. dodson495

    dodson495 Life is Good

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    remember after the first fight chael had with silva he tested positive for steroids
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  16. UnbrokeN

    UnbrokeN Well-Known Member

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    chhael on roids is better than Machida on Piss.
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  17. DethStryque

    DethStryque DethStryque theInvincible

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    jones won't be able to fight silva because they cannot meet at a catchweight. Jones is too big to fight at anything under 205, and has basically outgrown the LHW Division already. He's making a hard cut to stay in the LHW this year, and will be HW in 2014.

    Plus I didn't forget that those guys...Chael, Bonnar, and let's be real about it Vitor...were on roids.
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  18. dodson495

    dodson495 Life is Good

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    yea jones said he walks around 230 pounds already. think after he fight gustafsson
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  19. Makabreli

    Makabreli done

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    the thought of silva vs bones is ridiculous. both guys often enjoy fighting with a reach advantage, and in bones' case a major reach advantage. we're talking about putting a slightly big middleweight striker in against a huge light heavyweight wrestler who could move up to heavyweight and hit anyone with his jab standing anywhere in the octagon.

    to me, this is like wanting to stick sugar ray robinson in against a klitschko.

    gsp vs anderson is a far more interesting and even fantasy matchup. not a huge difference in fighting weight, the smaller guy has all the skills and strategy needed to beat the bigger guy, and the bigger guy will be looking to use his scientific striking rather than any size advantage to beat the smaller guy.

    as for any fantasy fight featuring jones, make the guy on the other end a heavyweight.
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  20. FarooqHakim

    FarooqHakim Dot Dorbal

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    I think from the 205 division down to 155 those kind of match ups aren't really possible anymore. Ever champion cuts so much weight and are generally huge for their own division. Frankie Edgar was really the only plausible one, even Dominick Cruz look like a normal sized dude fighting Mighty Mouse, and that's a one division difference.

    I'm not saying Jones whipping on Silva makes him better than Silva either. He's half his age and came up in a time when Silva had been known about in a family full of athletes and he's a Chael Sonnenesque bad match up for Silva regardless of size.
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