VIRGIN MARY BIRTH EXPOSED

Discussion in 'The Sanctuary' started by lyricalpriest, Jan 5, 2014.

  1. lyricalpriest

    lyricalpriest Rap Games Dawson Creek

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    The Virgin Birth Theory Exposed


    Speculation has run somewhat wild over the question if Christ was conceived in the womb of his mother Mary by the Holy Spirit and born while Mary was yet a virgin.


    The accounts of the birth of Jesus appear in only two of the four Canonical Gospels, the Gospel of Luke and the Gospel of Matthew. Luke 2:1-7 and Matthew 2:1


    Now according to modern Christian doctrine Jesus was conceived in the womb without a Human Father which would have been Joesph. So that would mean that Christ could NOT have come from the SEED of David if we were to go by the Virgin Birth Theory

    In scripture the Hebrews have continually said that Christ the Messiah would come from the SEED of David or lineage of David. In order for this to be TRUE Marry would have had to come from the Seed of David and it should be mentioned in scripture lets look at the following verses to explain the Messiahs birth through the lineage of David.

    Now what Does the Word SEED mean according to scripture SEED is also called SPERM:

    1." And if any man's seed of copulation go out from him, then he shall wash all his flesh in water, and be unclean until the even".-----Leviticus 15-16.


    2. ""Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a woman have conceived seed, and born a man child: then she shall be unclean seven days; according to the days of the separation for her infirmity shall she be unclean."-------------Leviticus 12-2

    So according to scriptures Sperm was called SEED

    Now lets find out from the Hebrews themselves what lineage their messiah would come from

    1) Acts 13-22-23 - "And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave their testimony, and said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will.
    23 Of this man's SEED hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

    2) Acts 2-29-30 - "Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
    Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his LOINS, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;"

    According to scripture Christ the Hebrew Messiah would come from the Sperm(Lineage) of David. So That CLEARLY means Marry would of had to be from the Lineage of David in Order to prove this Virgin Birth Theory, if Mary WAS NOT from the Lineage of David you must GET RID of the False Virgin Story

    The New Testament only has 2 books(Matthew )and (Luke ) that reference the Lineage of Christ and Marry is not mentioned as being from the Lineage of David, BUT Joesph is mentioned 3 times in the Gospel as being from the Lineage of David:

    1) Matthew 1-16 is the Lineage of Joesph and NOT MARRY SHE is Not mentioned as being from the SEED of David

    Matthew 1-15-16 " And Eliud begat Eleazar; and Eleazar begat Matthan; and Matthan begat Jacob; And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ."

    So according to Matthew Christs Father Joseph came from a man named Jacob who was from the SPERM of David no mention of Mary coming from this lineage

    Now lets go to another book that tracks down Josephs and Christs lineage. In the book of Luke 2 chapter 4th verse CLEARLY says that Joseph is From the Lineage of David NOT MARY!

    2) Luke 2-4-5 " And all went to be taxed, every one into his own city.
    And Joseph also went up from Galilee, out of the city of Nazareth, into Judaea, unto the city of David, which is called Bethlehem; (because he was of the house and lineage of David:)
    To be taxed with Mary his espoused wife, being great with child."


    3) Luke 3-23 ""And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,"

    In Parentheses (as was supposed) in Greek nomos means= I practice, hold by custom; I deem, think, consider, suppose.


    In the Strong's Concordance: Greek word nomos 3543

    nomos; : to practice, consider
    Original Word:
    Part of Speech: Verb
    Transliteration: nomizó
    Phonetic Spelling: (nom-id'-zo)
    Definition: properly, to do by law (usage) To accustom (passively, be usual); by extension, to deem or regard -- suppose, thing, be wont.

    So in other words the author Luke is simply saying that it was commonly accepted and known that Christ came from the Sperm of Joseph.
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  2. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Mary too was from the line of david
    it was customary however to name the line of the father. the two geaneologies shows that both ways he was rightfully heir.
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  3. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    The geneolgy in matt 1:1is traced through Joseph, Jesus’ legal (though not natural) father, and it establishes His claim and right to the throne of David (v. 6). The genealogy in Luke 3:23-38 is evidently that of Mary, though some believe it is also Joseph’s, by assuming that Matthan (Matt 1:15) and Matthat ( Luke 3:24) were the same person and Jacob (Matt 1:16) and Eli (Luke 3:23) were brothers (one being Joseph’s father and the other his uncle). See note on Luke 3:23.
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  4. The_K3

    The_K3 ^Secksi^

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    bitch was a hoe

    bay girl aint no virgin
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  5. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    smh at LP

    you should study more before you fall for every wind of doctrine and copy/paste things. I understand fully that this may seem correct to you, what you posted, so not hate whatsoever on ya.

    join us live on shabbat, PM me for info...come study and learn from scriptures, not what the unlearned have to say in posts on the internet lol

    love ya fam
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2014
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  6. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    Mary could be from the line of David, but it don't matter because the seed is passed from the man, not from the woman. Meaning you are what your father is. Also there is no spot in scripture that indicates who or what Mary was or what her line was....they left that out because it is not important, again the seed is passed from man.

    Even if Mary was from David's seed, it would not matter in any wise.
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  7. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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  8. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    He thinks the lineage in Luke is Mary's lineage... yet both lineages end at JOSEPH. I've already discussed this with him, but he's half retarded.

    And good point about the seed. He still won't listen though.
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  9. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    I just posted that. the majority of biblical scholarship understand luke as being her actual line and not a repeat of matt. She was not named not because it wasnt important but because the cultural recognition is from the man.
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  10. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    U have no right to correct lp if ur in essence agreeing with him.
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  11. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Luke ends with eli
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  12. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Heres another gem, and why coup is wrong in his assumption of why it "matters"
    Finally, in the Joseph genealogy is a man named Jeconiah. God cursed Jeconiah (also called Coniah), stating that no descendant of his would ever sit on the throne of David, "For no man of his descendants will prosper sitting on the throne of David or ruling again in Judah," (Jer. 22:30). But Jesus, of course, will sit on the throne in the heavenly kingdom. The point is that Jesus is not a biological descendant of Jeconiah, but through the other lineage -- that of Mary. Hence, the prophetic curse upon Jeconiah stands inviolate. But, the legal adoption of Jesus by Joseph reckoned the legal rights of Joseph to Jesus as a son, not the biological curse. This is why we need two genealogies: one of Mary (the actually biological line according to prophecy), and the legal line through Joseph.
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  13. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    Contemporary scholars? If so, the only reason you are taking them seriously is because it resolves what you see as an inconsistency. But what reason do scholars have for believing it is Mary's lineage other than resolving an inconsistency? If cultural recognition is from the man, why bother to list Mary's genealogy at all? Somebody thought it important to write it down? But misidentified whose genealogy it was? Doesn't sound inspired to me. And why is Joseph's important as well, if Jesus is not in the bloodline (ie. the virgin birth)? The whole point of a genealogy is bloodlines.
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2014
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  14. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    Ends with Joseph, actually. Crack open a bible for once before spewing inaccuracies.
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  15. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    Don't know if you were talking to me but...

    Yahshua was born of a virgin, of the holy spirit. In fact this verse clearly shows this (among others). All one needs is a reading comprehension. (not directed at you payback, just saying in general).

    This verse is pretty clear: Matthew 1

    18 Now the birth of Yahshua messiah was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

    The did not know each other yet, or have sex. Espoused is pretty much what we call being engaged today.

    19 Then Joseph her husband, being a just man, and not willing to make her a public example, was minded to put her away privily.


    Joeseph here though Mary committed adultery here^. They had made a covenant and he thought she broke it with another man, whom he believed put his seed in her via intercourse/sex etc.

    Nope. This verse is clear, so are many other scriptures.

    Now the virgin birth is not to be confused with the pagan immaculate conception. Two different things.


    //

    And the genealogy in Matthew is not correct, well it is, but it is missing some fathers as you can clearly pick up in the so called OT, in the books of Kings. The writers probably wanted to make it even 14.

    As this verse states in Matthew 1

    17 So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David until the carrying away into Babylon are fourteen generations; and from the carrying away into Babylon unto Christ are fourteen generations.

    The audience for Matthew were Hebrews, so keep in mind the historical Hebrew context here.

    So the Matthew genealogy is often called the "Royal Genealogy", a neat cut presentation to the people.

    It don't matter what scholarship believes, because they cannot possibly know the answer. They can form theories to fit their ideas and customs (like the 'jews' in the land of Ysrael today) There custom is that you are what your mother is, which is a contradiction from YAHUWAH's order...the point is scriptures did not mention one thing about it, about Mary. No tribe no, nation, no ethnicity.

    Elizabeth was Mary's cousin, she was a Hebrew. But that don't prove and thing because the seed comes from the man and we are not told how they are related by mother or father.

    It's not important anyhow.

    //

    And if you really want another study, both Matthew and Luke list different fathers for Joeseph...that takes understanding of scriptures to understand.
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  16. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    The original Greek says Joseph was "of Heli" or Eli(which is not refering to elizabeth coup) (verse23). In fact, since Joseph's father is said to be Jacob in Matthew 1:16, Heli is Mary's father. Joseph, then, is his son-in-law.
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2014
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  17. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    According to Israel's law, when a daughter is the only heir, she can inherit her father's possessions and rights if she marries withinherown tribe (Numbers 27:1-8; 36:6-8). There is no record that Mary had any brothers to inherit her father's possessions and rights. Thus, Joseph became Heli's heir by marriage to Mary, inheriting the right to rule on David's throne, even
    over Judah. This right then passed
    ontoJesus.
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  18. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Because of a curse that God placed on one of Joseph's ancestors, Jesus could never sit upon the throne of David if Joseph had been His natural father.

    Jechonias (Matthew 1:11-12), called Coniah in Jeremiah 22:24-30, was so evil God cursed him and his descendants, saying, "Write this man down as childless, . . . fornone ofhis descendants shall prosper, sitting on the throne of David, and ruling anymore in Judah" (verse 30). Jeconiah,as his name is spelled in the Old Testament, had children (I Chronicles 3:17), but he was childless insofar as none of his descendants
    ruled as king over Judah.

    plus in order for christ to be born without the nature of sin we are born into by being from the seed of our fathers he neesed be born through the woman only. The Messiah must be the seed of Woman (Genesis 3:15)

    It is written. in respects to the father in that it was customary to culture to do so. u know ur traditions of men.
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