Undercover Christian (Based on a true Story)

Discussion in 'Poetry Realm' started by UFO the Phoenix, Apr 24, 2005.

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  1. Clarksvegas_Dan

    Clarksvegas_Dan Registered Voter

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    I'm sorry UFO. I can tell you're really upset. I wasn't there with you, so I couldn't say what happened and it wouldn't be right for me to make assumptions. I do believe that the book of revelations is fascinating, and meaningful. But like all dreams it is a matter of interpretation. I have studied the different forms of modern dream analysis, and compared them to the ancient, spiritual forms of dream interpretation. It was a powerful and important dream.
    I don't mean to put you on the spot. I believe you when you say that you love God, and Jesus Christ. I do too. And I do believe that God and Jesus Christ love you. I think, though, that the members of any church are only human. Maybe their were some bad people in the congregation you attended. Maybe they won't be there for long. God has a way of sorting things out. Also, I know I deal with a lot of flack as a result of my beliefs, from believers and non-believers alike. Maybe they have let such negativity affect their judgement. And maybe they did see you as something that you were not. But they are only human too. Is it possible though, that perhaps, you saw them as something they were not.
    When the African tribes first encountered Europeans, both groups believed the other to be Evil. One group carried a bible, the other group carried parables in their heart. In fact, neither group was evil. They just couldn't relate to one another, and intolerance led to warfare and slavery. History sometimes, can seem like a tragedy. But I prefer to view history as a story of man reaching out to the heavens, and God taking their hand, like Michaelangelo's painting in the Sisteen Chapel. Again, I'm sorry for pushing the issue so far. Take care. Peace.
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  2. UFO the Phoenix

    UFO the Phoenix I DONT BELIEVE IN ALIENS!

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    ^I can respect that Luther....I still think God makes us different for a reason....he wants us all to worship him in our own unique ways....if we were all the same this world would be fruitless to him......but again that church did not praise the God I know....it was dark....it was ANTI-CHRIST.....period

    Almostfamous thanks for the prayers....honestly since people been praying for me the nightmares have stopped....whatever demons followed me out of that church are gone....at least for the most part


    Note to mindsoul:

    "Undercover Christian" = is me because I cant walk around talking about Jesus these days....everywhere I go I feel like I'm undercover....christians have such a bad rep that the good ones are afriad to speak up now ah days....we are being shoved off in this conor which only tells me that these are mos def the last days.....when people have itchy ears only wanna listen to what justifys their sins....when people want to be THEIR OWN GOD's....when we worship confusion.....babylon......again when I went to that church I didnt judge them...from what I saw these people looked miserable...UNHAPPY...church isnt suppose to be like that....and dispite the fact they claim they love all god's and welcome everyone...I FELT UNWELCOME THERE....my presense alone caused some distrubance and odd stares....I called myself "UNDERCOVER CHRISTIAN" because people automatically assumed I was a lost soul and looked at me with pity....everywhere I go its like that....if people could see into my soul they would see something completly different


    last up
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  3. reincarnation

    reincarnation New Member

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    The kids look like miserable robots
    With painted frowns herded around
    Like joyless cattle in the wrong flock
    The parents look even more lost
    Shuffling in seats like nervous beast
    I’m witnessing some invisible holocaust
    Fifty people or so stuffed in an onion box
    Surrounded by vampires, witches, and warlocks
    I’m wishing I would of brought my garlic salt…
    On the wall there’s no holy cross


    heheh...love your poem..hahah...it was crazy..u taking it to next level...that'z good
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  4. eM-T

    eM-T Because We Are

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    can I be a good person and not believe in god.

    UFO man, I got nothing against the super churchy people because I was for so long on of them. But after absorbing myself into that heavily for 13 years and getting nowhere... well I decided one day (perhaps after a nightmare of two) that I was, for the first time going to believe in myself. I don't need to justify my sins because according to christian orthodox, I am a good person. So will that be recognized in the end days you speak of? Or am I doomed to hell for the simple fact that I believe in the individual?

    I have pushed religious people ina corner too, I admit. But it is because I have been there. And I know what it feels like to know that I am right. You have to know, otherwise you have no faith. But I can to realize.. knowing... and completely accepting a concept that the human mind cannot understand is very different. That is to say, I didn't know anything, but I sure as hell thought I knew it all.

    the end of the world is not coming. Religion was around in the dark ages. It was around before humans realized to the potential of their own thoughts and actions. Now that we have the ability to fend for ourselves, Jesus is no more than a placebo.

    This doesnt mean I am evil, or a sinner. I am me. I am a good person not because I fear hell... fuck hell ... I think its bullshit. I AMMMM a good person, because I WANT TO BE. I dont value heaven... or jesus. I value you real people who have real feelings and are in real, fucked up places. Jesus can fend for himself is just a person or entity still exists.

    God takes care of himself and so should you.
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  5. UFO the Phoenix

    UFO the Phoenix I DONT BELIEVE IN ALIENS!

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    *shakes his head in dissappointment and a broken heart what have I started*
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  6. MisterEThoughts

    MisterEThoughts MysteryOfUntoldTruth

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    Well, THis is quite intense... UFo brother don't worry about what you started.. .It's better you starting this... because they need to hear that truth... I am not going to preach not my intention... I am going to simply say.. .THis poem is quite beautiful... It's full of truth.. Now, if you kids don't see it thats cool... I suggest you take a closer look... I mean i understand not everyone going to be fond of religion... Most people think religion brakes people as well as religion is man made... Is there proof? yea, you might say there isn't proof about Jesus and such... but i can say not true there is... Now we might argue.... I know that isn't going to really get us anywhere... but what i do suggest is just ask questions about everything.. .Don't be close minded that you can't see what you have under your nose... read and learn... and just be prepared...be open to anything that comes your way... I mean don't think that this is all thats going to happen (you all know what i mean by that) I think UFO did a wonderful job... I truly believe you should speak whatever you feel or went through i loved this deeply.... no lie... I trully believe you should keep this up bro... you might raise a question but believe me they will talk and not believe but the time will come where they will be struck at least they will be ready... someone needs to struck someone here... that might change a few things... ok i am going to stop... i am just going randomly ... You get the idea though... I loved this... and just be on a lookout... and just observe read. .and learn.. and ask questions on everything... don't be hiding out... UFO i will tell you more when we speak... don't worry you did a wonderful job... i truly loved it... I know everyone else did too... they just have problems with religion most people do... it's ok... we are not here preaching we here observing and letting them know whats up.. if they don't want to take what we give they don't have too... they will ache for it sooner or later... promise you that... 1 good job bro....
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  7. eM-T

    eM-T Because We Are

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    "ive read some books and Ive grown quite brave
    if I could just speak up I think I would say
    there is no truth
    there is only you
    and what you make the truth"

    "is it true what I heard about the son of God
    did he die for us
    did he die at all
    and if I cleaned his feet with my dirty hair
    would he make me clean again?"

    "well I dont know when but a days gonna come
    where their wont be a moon and their wont be a sun
    it will all go black
    it will just go back to the way it was before"

    "NOW men with purple hearts carry silver guns
    and they'll KILL A MAN for what his fathers done
    but what MY father did
    you know IT DONT MEAN SHIT

    IM NOT HIMM"

    - Conor Oberst (Bright Eyes)
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  8. This poem was quite enigmatic and the place you decribes was very eery. I dont know what to make of this, as a poem it was very descriptive and said to me ' go with your heart'.

    This is my first Unitarian Universalist visit
    I timidly explain to the animated women
    Sitting next to me
    Perplexed by my peace while others sing
    She gives me a cheerful smile
    Void of love
    The corner of her eyes judging me
    Reflecting her lies, I suppose


    This part I found quite startling as it gave the reader the impression that you were being lured into something and without that intuition others could have been too. That part also where he woman dissapears, that was like a horror flick feel. What kind of church was this? did it seem as evil as you make out or were they just spiritualists who werent 'religious?'.

    anyway, interesting poem man!
    stay up
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  9. Clarksvegas_Dan

    Clarksvegas_Dan Registered Voter

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    I agree with eM-T, but I don't. I consider Jesus to be a great teacher of mystic truths for the western world. Most people just don't recognize mysticism when they see it, or like eM-T, they don't care to understand.

    ^I can respect that Luther....I still think God makes us different for a reason....he wants us all to worship him in our own unique ways....if we were all the same this world would be fruitless to him......but again that church did not praise the God I know....it was dark....it was ANTI-CHRIST.....period

    ^^For you, it had to be. The end times prophecy was a medieval theological concept. Fortunately we don't live in Medieval Europe. Every generation had some group of believer screaming the end is here, the end is here. They thought the Black Death was the end of the world. We're still here.

    never did I point them out and call them sinners?....

    ^That is exactly what you've done here. Besides, you don't have to say a word. Your thoughts can affect the world, without ever being spoken. If you felt spiritually under attack, well, perhaps it was only psychological. But, from the perspective that everything is spiritual, yes you were under attack. You were the 'Undercover Christian,' which is to say that you wandered into a place where your doctrine wouldn't hold, so yes you were under attack. Imagine a radical liberal walking into the Republican National Convention. It would terrorize his psyche. What Jesus taught about metaphysics, is the same as all sages...You are beckoning all of your misfortunes to enter into your life, on a sub-atomic quantum level.

    you might not understand how deep that was

    ^ Of course I understand. I am persecuted too. In fact, I'd really like to stop hearing fundamentalist christians sing the blues about how they're getting a bad lot in life. Christians are the wealthiest people on earth. They are the only socially accepted religion in the United States. Not to mention they are the only group to have dropped an Atomic Bomb, on other non-christian peoples. They have even inslaved the bulk of the non-christian world. Money talks, and so the christian Religion is an easy win. Even today, Christianity is the only religion with any real power in government, and that power is outrageous.

    ^you getting to deep with it...I dont think its gotta be that complicated

    It simply is that complicated. Your religion asks you to swear allegiance before or even without showing you the truth. Their faith works conversely. They are the ones who realized that the religions did not have a complete view, their questions just weren't being answered, so they went where the answers were...The Library....they discoverd the truth without some mediary between them and God and now they swear allegiance because they know it is the right thing to do. You were welcome at their church. Would they be welcome at yours.

    "May those be angry with you who do not know with how much effort the truth is sought." St. Augustine of Hippo, 3rd cent. AD
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  10. eM-T

    eM-T Because We Are

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    eh man, all I was saying is truth is an individual perspective. Therefor it is biased. Its like saying blue is your favoritve color because it is mine. I know its my favorite color.. how the fuck can you say its not. And so that is MY truth. Every detail I used in my minds eye to construct the world is completely biased based on MY experience. And I KNOW i am right, AND YOU KNOW you are. And a billion others who think different things and know it is the truth. All truth is biased.

    therefore, there is not truth, there is only you and what you make the truth.
    ^is that the truth. Fuck yea it is.. but its mine... so.... what does any of it really matter?

    ifs your stiff conservative christians right now bombing the shit out of the middle east for oil. And they are justified, god bless the loose ended bible.

    and luther man, you cant tell me I just dont care. I poured my heart into religion for 13 years. Church every sunday, and wednsday. Beyond that how many of you have read the bible??? oh .. okay that is interesting. I take the bible for what it is. a collection of fiction stories that carry good messages that if followed, would be good (or could be) good for humanity. Problem with you churchys is you are religious until you start living your life and are threatened by the bottom line. Or perhaps its the jones's next door. Religion and Capitalism. It they werent so closely related we wouldnt have religious gov't officials. Or you know... officials who pretend to be religious.

    anyway... I dont need to be afraid of hell to be a good person. I don't believe in the reward system either.. fucking bribery is what it is. I know what I have RIGHT THE FUCK NOW and I ain't going to live this life convinced that Im going to have something better. I am going to MAKE THE BEST of what I have. thats ss it.

    but anyway... we all got to do our own thing. We both know the truth and its cool that we are both wrong too. Its what keeps us going. I got me and you got... yours.
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  11. Clarksvegas_Dan

    Clarksvegas_Dan Registered Voter

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    lol. Once again, I agree with eM-T, but I don't. lol. I do like your perspective and agree that you have nothing to fear. There is no hell except for that of your own creation.
    Oh btw, I didn't mean that you didn't care to understand religion, I meant that you didn't care to understand mysticism. I didn't mean it as an insult, I just meant that I doubt that during your church-going years your pastor ever suggested you read the Bhagavad-Gita or the Gnostic gospels, and I doubt he had any kind of Gnostic exegesis of the Pauline letters. Anyways, the Bhagavad Gita is a beautiful work of Spiritual Poetry, Ghandi lived by it, Martin Luther King Jr. did too, and Henry David Thoreau, just to name a few.
    I agree that being a good person is all that is necessary, but I do believe in God, the Self-Aware Universe. That is called Pantheism, UFO. The belief that God is in Everything. It was considered Heresy in the 11-15th centuries. A lot of people were burned at the stake, for believing it. My Methodist sunday school teacher told me exactly that--God is in Everything. Like eM-T said, the Truth isn't constant, it changes. It's lucid like a dream. The Christianity in existance today, I mean the doctrine, is not at all what the apostles and their followers practiced. I doubt very many of today's christians are going to be willing to practice extreme ascetism, celibacy, OR CHANTING.
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  12. Clarksvegas_Dan

    Clarksvegas_Dan Registered Voter

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    I'm sorry, but this is pretty much all I think about. It's odd that UFO is getting flack from a non-believer on the one hand and a New Age spiritualist on the other. Sorry.
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  13. eM-T

    eM-T Because We Are

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    haha... hey I think if a poem can spark this much discussion he has done something right. (by the way I never mentioned I really like your concept behind your title) so I did what any good american spirited person would do. I stole it.

    Thanks for the clarification luther. I hear what you are saying man. And I like you take that God is everything. I am very hesitant to use the word God myself, because of the assumptions most people already have attached to it based on their own perspective (more of that good ol' fashion biased truth) but I believe in spirituality, which is the same concept that this life energy is a part of everything. So we pretty much thinking along the same lines, I just phrase it more carefully to my own standard of belief.

    nice chat haha.

    -EmpTy
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  14. Black Liquid

    Black Liquid New Member

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    word very visual, good vocab too, all you gotta do is tweak the flow a lil bit. good shit though. watch out for the devil
    -Liq
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  15. Sole Sovereign

    Sole Sovereign Hungry But Never Starving

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    Decent poem from a literary stand point, research should have been done however to keep facts within it straight and when doing an analytical piece you should probably consider a bit more maturity in word selection. Definately not one of my favorite pieces from you, but it wasn't terrible.
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  16. areeyesee

    areeyesee New Member

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    yo this is just a sign that the lord is on his way, im sorry u had to witness that but i guess god wanted u to serve as a witnes to let others know, and ya poem was DEEP like mya angelou and nas speaking about doctor king at the bottom of the atlantic
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