Two things as justification for non-belief in God

Discussion in 'The Sanctuary' started by M-theory, Dec 18, 2010.

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  1. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    1. Unawareness concerning the events set out in God's creation
    2. The nature of, and existence of deception and false testimony

    I believe that the most significant of my thoughts can be narrowed down to the above two points. I recognize the second point as weak in comparison to the first for a variety of reasons.

    Perhaps I will give a more detailed explanation of the two, but as far as discussion goes this thread is open for questions and comments first if you're capable of wrapping your head around what goes into this train of thought.
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  2. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    In the last days there will be an "increase in false teaching" that is true. Thats why knowing what the word of God says so that u do not fall victim to doctrines of demons is imperitive.
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  3. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    God is better than the book.
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  4. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    The book is the word of God. So it must be pretty powerful if the last time he spoke the universe was spoken into existance.
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  5. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    That's a creepily mind consuming way of addressing this. You appear to believe that the Bible (Genesis through Revelation) was spoken into existence at the same time as the universe. Am I mistaken?
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  6. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    in the begining was the word. And the word was with God. And the word was God.
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  7. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    john 1:1
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  8. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    I know the verse but if you are claiming what I just spoke about and using John 1:1 to support that you are taking the book out of context and out of translation, in as far as I can comprehend.

    The Koine (Greek) word used was LOGOS.

    G3056 (from Strong's Concordance)
    λόγος
    logos
    log'-os
    From G3004; something said (including the thought); by implication a topic (subject of discourse), also reasoning (the mental faculty) or motive; by extension a computation; specifically (with the article in John) the Divine Expression (that is, Christ): - account, cause, communication, X concerning, doctrine, fame, X have to do, intent, matter, mouth, preaching, question, reason, + reckon, remove, say (-ing), shew, X speaker, speech, talk, thing, + none of these things move me, tidings, treatise, utterance, word, work.

    I would bold the part I'm pointing to, but the code's still off, so I'll just explain.

    Whereas it could mean something said, or communicated, and at least according to Strong's, doctrine... I'm not entirely certain that this includes anything that is written (unless it were, of course, recited).

    The word I looked up in Strong's for written was γράφω, meaning "to grave" or "to write" also write could be in the past tense, or figuratively "to describe." In that sense, I might say aloud that "It is written: The Sanctuary forum is off to a good start and is fun to post in..." if someone had said it without it actually having been written, although now that I've typed it sort of is written. This is the kind of thing I was getting at about the promoting of certain figures of speech when I talked about the way they might say things are "already here" to prove it as a certainty of things to come. "It is written" might basically mean that whoever is saying it believes it to be accurate or set in stone and not possible to renege on.

    And of course, the last point I am going to touch on is the meaning of "Word" in John, as Strong's says above that it specifically means Divine Expression, that is Christ. Jesus Christ is the Word. To praise the book as if it were the Divine Expression is bibliolatry, that is worshipping the Bible as an Idol. I'm not accusing you of such. Let's just get things straight.

    The next use of "Word" in John Chapter 1, in context, plainly states that the Word was made Flesh - giving you no reason to doubt that this was an allusion to Christ, and putting the earlier reference 1:1 the meaning that was intended.

    Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

    It says the Word (Christ) is the only begotten of the Father. The Bible can't be begotten of the Father. Only Jesus is. It says Jesus was full of grace and truth. If the Bible says the Bible is full of grace and truth, you have no reason to believe it - it's an entirely circular notion. If I say I am God, that doesn't mean I am God. And if the Bible says Jesus is full of grace and truth, I need to hear from Jesus. The Bible says a bunch more things, even attributing the words to Jesus, even circling what they claim Jesus said back to what is written in the Bible. But how do I know that the Bible is the truth? Through faith? Because the Bible tells me so?
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  9. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    your right. JESUS'S existance was to fullfill the physical manifestion of Gods will on earth. And to abolish the law of the old testiment by fullfilling it himself.
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  10. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    So for ex. Gods manifestation on earth was jesus( if u have seen me u ha seen the father)(i have not came to abolish the law but to fullfill the law) christ Is the new law) thats why belief in his is sufficiant for salvation.
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