The real Intellectuals (Riz, McGirth, Soultan, Sun Zoo, etc.) - My book continues!

Discussion in 'IntroSpectrum' started by Ghet for Prez, Oct 23, 2007.

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  1. Red1

    Red1 A Figure of Speech

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    Oh and I could see how genetic engineering that meant children were being born basically autistic would be something rejected in many parts of the world. It would be interesting to see it justified and how that plays out in your novel.

    What is multidimensional math?
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  2. Sodium

    Sodium I Get Computers Putin'

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    Isnt taht what Nietszche did? w/ the superman (that hoooo)?

    because yeah that does work fairly well in the sense that it sucks people in.
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  3. Sodium

    Sodium I Get Computers Putin'

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    *cranks that souljaboy for no apparent reason*
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  4. Sanctions crippled Iraq so that it's military infrastructure would not put up a modern defense. That was the only purpose of a sanction of that caliber. (And, maybe starving the people so they would be ready to embrace Socialist Liberal economic policies, but that has yet to be seen. Give that 10 more years when the old economic entities in Iraq have bankrupted themselves on unless violent resistance or have consolidated into a seperate nation [which is what my book suggests])

    Sanctions in North Korea have threatened China's regional influence and seeks to destabilize Japan. China will intervene. They absolutely have to.

    Sannctions work. Currently, they just take a -REALLY- long time. All siege warfare takes a while. The people on the parapet can shout whatever slogans they want inside to antagonize and criticize. But in the end, they'll all starve and submit if (and only if) they wish to participate with the rest of the world.

    Economic sanctions, in a world that is connected to the degree that it will be 50 years from now, a global market where a mistyped email from a PDA in Nebraska can result in the economic dumping of all Vietnamese currency held in Germany for the next two weeks will create the global market infrastructure of nearly unlimited capital. If you wish to be part of that, you best not have any active sanctions going on... or be really content being ruler of a land that will probably get invaded by multinational forces within the next 10 years. Sanctions will have alot more impact in a global market then in the proto-global market of 1950 (see North Korea)

    Nuclear weapons are nifty, but without a meaningful delivery system, they only become a regional threat, prompting compromise and problems on that level, forcing regional big dogs to step in. If you have access to people who willingly want to die, (via Islam) give them biological fanny-packs and tell them to walk around crowded Western cities for a while. That's alot more dangerous. But nation entities don't do that. They aren't out to kill uselessly like that UNLESS it directly translates to power. (And not military intervention) Blockaded nations will throw fits, and tantrums, and hissy fits, but then become exhausted. And then desperate. And then either accept their role (Cuba) or go out with a bang (Iraq and maybe Korea)
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  5. McGirth

    McGirth New Member

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    yah okay. your right when were talking about power over minds. it appeals to mini-tyrants really
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  6. Amorality is an important transitional phase to overcoming these useless embargos we currently have on developing biotechnology. If you think Conservatives are bad with abortion and stemcells, wait until Environmentalists start whining about "Genetic tampering and waste of plants and livestock" like they do in Europe.

    Personally, I say man the fuck up, and embrace your future instead of being reluctant. But I know there are other elements in play.
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  7. It's not about that. Autistic people have, somehow, not been given the instruction manual on how their brain should interpret basic human communication protocols (emotion) and have, instead, have other parts of their brain given an intersting focus. For example, you watch TV to be entertained. Some autistic savants calculate prime numbers up to the 8,000s in their head for the same "feeling".

    Multidimensional math is something that the human brain is not intrinstically given the assets to figure out. Imagine you a stick figure in your 2D world of paper. (Height, width) You have everything you need. And then one day, you are told a 3d dimension exists (depth) and you have no idea how to figure it out because everything you know is in 2D. In our world, we have complicated math that suggests 11 possibile dimension for atomic gravity (strings) or relativity suggests a 4th spatial dimension. Humans have to use very complicated equations to "see" these dimensions. The kids in my novel are actually able to imagine them, outside of spatial expectation.

    That's not true. Humans DO have "extraspatial" capabilities, but we call that lingustics ;D (Which is also what the book attempts to explain) My kids will literally have extraspatial capabilities that will allow them to imagine complex multidimension structures as easy as you can recall your own name.
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  8. Sodium

    Sodium I Get Computers Putin'

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    mini-tyrants yeah but it can be guised to suck in other dispositions. like using Nietzch'e s whole superman idea as example. The superman I think is similar to what Ghet promotes. A new, hyper enlightened, super wise, truly alive person. Everybody else is trash. I made a thread about this before. That is, you can drape people in new dispositions by creating a way for them to be superior (beautiful) and showing them how any other way would make them inferior (ugly). Come to think....religion uses this very method too. The person when presented with both options - if he can somehow accept them as true - essentially gets squeezed into the new disposition as he has no other direction to go.

    Anyway look at how many fans Nietszche has. or say, Christianity. I can see Ghet (the Taleus) playing the same game with his. He just has to decorate his view to the brim and show how everybody else is dumb. He good at that.
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  9. Red1

    Red1 A Figure of Speech

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    So your suggestion is that as we become more interconnected sanctions become more powerful and therefore eliminating the need for military intervention?

    What about the idea that interconnectivity breeds interdependence meaning sanctions cannot be used to target specific governments or states? And again this would mean that the major powers would be more reliant on one another than smaller states and therefor potentially more suceptable to the effects of the global market. Especially since most of the largest economic players are net importers and most of the smaller players are net exporters. (China obviously exports quite a bit now but you can imagine as their middle class grows they could go the route of the US in the 20th century).

    However, this is starting to seem as though it is getting off subject from your original post and I do not wish to hijack your thread.
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  10. No, this isn't Ubermensch. Why are yo so fast to provide insight on a topic that isn't even finished yet? Is there a website somewhere that gives you a neural cam into my head?

    No, please, tell me more about my book.
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  11. Red1

    Red1 A Figure of Speech

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    I see. I have a better understanding why people would reject genetic engineering of that sort. If you were only talking about genetically engineered food or something, I was not sure I would be sold. But since you are talking about genetic engineering of people and apparently a method that is not entirely "safe" I think I buy the premise.
    It is too bad you do not plan on dealing with the moral implications or reasoning behind some nations withdrawing from such technology and others embracing it. Even if it was not the sole purpose of your book, the chance for drama and character development seems limitless.
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  12. Sodium

    Sodium I Get Computers Putin'

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    No I mean you're general views over the years, G. I know them fairly well. If you wanna show them to the world I'm saying there is a way to do it to make it stick and a way to do it that probably won't. yeah?
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  13. It's not that military intervention wouldn't be needed. It's that it will be a poor deployment of resources when you consider the potential of economic warfare.

    Ahh, but resource interdependance in a global market is minimized by so many providers of needed resources. However, financial interdependance will always remain on the shoulders of the established. Most of the developed nations are connected via financial investment to the average American seeing purpose in paying the mortgage every month. If that was ever to shake, the global financial structure of the world would literally crumble before your very eyes.

    Canada exports 85% of anything they make directly to Canada. A Canadian spits, and 85% of the time, an American is there to catch it and put it on eBay.

    You see the picture yet?

    As long as Americans have a diverse appetite to consume exotic things, they will continue to pay their mortgage on a continent... that isn't even fully developed yet and won't be for another few hundred years. This provides nearlly unlimited growth potential, continuing to provide appeal to foreign investors to tie their money in with our housing market. I hate to simplify complex systems liek this, but essentially, the stability of our current global market is directly dependant on our desire to consume.

    If you do not have access to American stomachs, you ain't shit. And that's why sanctions work in the long run.
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  14. Ahh. I understand.

    Yes, I know.

    But this is important. If it happens to be intersting to alot of people, cool. If it isn't... I don't really care. Someone will find it later and go "holy hell how the fuck did he predict THAT!?"
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  15. McGirth

    McGirth New Member

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    i think the basic idea if biotech is used to alter human nature, it can undermine the political order (and science itself! which is based on the political order, yes it is!). basically, according to those who beleive in dystopian visions it can lead to stagnation.

    frankly i dont see hte problem with letting some other minor nation experiment with it & observe the consequences.
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  16. No, it wouldn't. Biotechnology would only destroy our preconcieved notions on what political order should be.

    That is the current stance in America. Sit at wait. Hop on at the right moment. But that sit and wait is fired by that extreme protectionist morality from both the Rigth and the Left. This clouds our ability to see when the moment is right. And before you know it, those little nations aren't little anymore and they can start calling the shots.

    It only took 200 years after Europe figured out firearms before it laid waste to everything in sight.
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  17. McGirth

    McGirth New Member

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    disagree. Your making a prediction that has no basis and claiming anything opposing immediate adoption it is normative, which is complete non-sense.

    The decision to limit biotech can be framed along power-considerations just as much as arguments in favour of it. [though i readily admit many authors frame their arguments in rights discourse :p. but really, maybe their just being tricky by using what works as legal tools]

    The difference is limiting it while allowing it in test phases in places like South Korea is more prudent then going all out with biotech in America, which is completely imprudent. Arguments for biotech going all out now are pure alarmism: "i.e. AMERICA MUST ACT NOW AND START BIOTECH OR w/N 5 YEARS WELL ALL BE WORKING FOR CHINA!!!." 200 years is a long-ass time in our modern world. As long as america holds the nuclear-space-airforce-master of science/property trump card, it can afford these experiments, especially with smaller states like south korea. An south korean army of biotech clones is easily destroyed by a nuke, and very very very likely this is not even close to ever being necessary.
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  18. McGirth,

    Our fear of biotechnology is unfounded. It is essentially inspired by Hollywood dystopia paranoia (Terminator, Matrix, etc.) The FEAR that you so graciously admitted by your own word PREDICTS a total collapse of all that is righteous and holy according to your view of how the world SHOULD operate.

    You can argue my points all day long, but your core motivation for this topic, by your own admission, is still a childish addiction to fear.
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  19. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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    Then no. Those problems will be resolved by then.
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  20. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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    Do you have well developed characters or will your book merely be preachy?

    This is important for fiction writing. If your book is just about the message and you're just trying to promote your philosophy or ideas then don't do it as a fiction. Just say what you think people need to hear and move on.
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