The Garden of Eden, the flood and pangea PART TWO

Discussion in 'The Sanctuary' started by Coup d'état, Dec 29, 2011.

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  1. N A S T Y

    N A S T Y Well-Known Member

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    you keep asking for proof of evolution but truth us you don't want proof you'll just close your eyes to it and point at a bible verse

    I will not argue any further for in your life a beautiful thing like god and faith have been soiled by the religion of man

    have a blessed day
    test
  2. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    Says the heathen scoffer walking after his lusts; ignorant of the Creation with his itchy ears that take to sciences falsely so called.
    test
  3. N A S T Y

    N A S T Y Well-Known Member

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    God loves you
    test
  4. x calibur

    x calibur

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    the issue here is that these sciences are very comprehensive. but I'll try to sum up.

    we have observed not only billions of stars, but billions of galaxies in the universe. we have also used mathematics and physics to determine that the most distant visible galaxies must have existed several billion years ago. due to continuous expansion of the universe and certain overarching patterns, the big bang theory is widely accepted.

    Age of the universe - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Hubble's law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    stars burn much too long for us to observe its lifetime. so what astronomers do is observe many different stars of various ages and points in their life cycle. from there, they construct models of how they form, progress and burn out. through observation, the elements they're made of (typically hydrogen or helium) can be determined. putting all the evidence together, we can reasonably approximate the life-cycle of various types of stars.

    Stellar evolution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Spectral line - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    planets are understood to typically form from protoplanetary discs around young stars. as gas, dust, and ices collide, they form larger clumps, which continue to accumulate matter until the disc runs out. depending on various factors, they can become terrestrial or gas giants.

    Formation and evolution of the Solar System - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Protoplanetary disk - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    as for chemical evolution? chemistry is a complex subject. but assuming you mean formation of the elements, almost everything was forged within the furnaces of stars. hydrogen and helium were created by the big bang. elements up to iron are created by the burning of stars (and cosmic ray interaction). elements heavier than iron were created by novas and supernovas, in which large stars exploded at the end of their life-cycle.

    Stellar nucleosynthesis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Chemical element - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    I'll group organic evolution and macro-evolution together. there is a vast number of species on the earth, living everywhere from the skies to the bottom of the ocean. the variety of living things in the world is incredible. almost every possible ecological niche has been filled by at least some species, if not a multitude. science continues to find new organisms in unlikely places, such as hydrothermal vents at the bottom of the ocean, hot springs, and nuclear waste.

    the main question is: how did all these species come to be? evolution is the large-scale mechanism proposed for this. basically, over generations of organisms, certain features and abilities are favored or disfavored by their environment. they are fit or unfit. the unfit tend to die off, while the fit reproduce in greater numbers. after enough time, the organisms with genetic fitness will have spread their genes widely and cause great changes. this fitness may come from a chance combination, or even a mutation. in either case, it allows species to adapt to their environment and changing conditions. it also allows them to occupy and exploit new niches. given millions of years, a cell becomes multicellular, which becomes something like a jellyfish, which becomes a more complex fish, which becomes an amphibian, which becomes an amniote, which becomes a reptile or mammal, which eventually led to apes, which led to us.

    that chain is very oversimplified, but there is clear logical progression, deviation, and development. all species on earth are descended from a common ancestor. chains of logical evolution have been created for almost all species on earth. all living things have certain traits in common, and rationally fit somewhere in the evolutionary system.

    Evolution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Introduction to evolution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Common descent - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    the common thread with all this is the use of science as a rational tool for understanding the world around us. I've already been generous in giving you an overview of these topics. there's already tons of literature that exists on this, if you're willing to read.
    test
  5. Sir Bustalot

    Sir Bustalot I am Jesus

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    ^^theyll just say the King james bible says youre wrong and scoff at your entire reply
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  6. x calibur

    x calibur

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    lol, pretty much. but I didn't mind doing that drop - it was kind of interesting to pull all that stuff together into one post. If I didn't personally want to go along with it, I definitely wouldntve bothered. word.
    test
  7. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    1. the big bang theory is widely accepted.

    Majority opinion is not evidence.

    2. We have never observed a star form.

    3. as gas, dust, and ices collide, they form larger clumps, which continue to accumulate matter until the disc runs out.

    This is pure religious speculation and has never been observed at all by anybody.


    4. up to iron are created by the burning of stars (and cosmic ray interaction). elements heavier than iron were created by novas and supernovas, in which large stars exploded at the end of their life-cycle.

    This is pure religious speculation and has never been observed. It is not possible to fuse past iron.


    5. basically, over generations of organisms, certain features and abilities are favored or disfavored by their environment. they are fit or unfit. the unfit tend to die off, while the fit reproduce in greater numbers. after enough time, the organisms with genetic fitness will have spread their genes widely and cause great changes. this fitness may come from a chance combination, or even a mutation

    a. mutations are only bad and have never been shown to be benefits (even in bacteria in the labs). This is what you believe and there is not on shred of evidence to support this religion. It only happens in your head and in computer models or text books.

    Variation does happen. There are limits. You will never have a dog produce a non dog no matter how much time has past. DNA does not gain, it only losses as in mutations.

    Your magic word is billions of years. Natural selection, selects. It does not create.


    You religion is all biased on assumptions. You have given me here many assumptions. Also, you treat me like I have no idea how this works. I understand it better than you, trust me. I am not dumb like you.


    So, give me your best evidence for evolution and we can talk. Save the speculation.

    Evolution is a state protected religion.
    test
  8. eashaya

    eashaya seer

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    X Calibur, your post contains assumptions, some of which were previously addressed. As much as I would really enjoy debating this with you, I won't.

    If interested please refer to my post in this thread: http://board.rapmusic.com/sanctuary...e-text-battle-re-buttal-person-above-you.html as well as some posts in other threads in this forum.

    I endeavour to give everyone the benefit of the doubt, so if I have the time and energy to reiterate and elaborate later, I will.
    test
  9. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    eashaya, sup ?

    I just bumped a few threads to get him up to speed

    -Your brother in Christ.
    test
  10. eashaya

    eashaya seer

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    I'm feeling a little lethargic at the minute, also quite surprised at the apparent lack of comprehension or blatant disregard for reason. Nevertheless, still enthusiastic and hopeful with all the promise that the dawn of a new year brings.
    test
  11. eashaya

    eashaya seer

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    The first Christian Church was the assembly of the followers of Christ, which was well before the Catholic Church. This clear distinction has previously been addressed.
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  12. x calibur

    x calibur

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    there are compelling reasons for the scientific consensus. direct observations have been analyzed, tested, cross-referenced, and peer-reviewed.

    it is only with the incredible forces unleashed by novas/supernovas that heavier elements are forged.

    we haven't seen the life-cycle of a single star, but he have observed many different stars in different states. these range from very early to very late. not only that, but we have records of supernovas taking place going back centuries, and the left over nebulae can be observed now. also, we have ancient star charts which are noticeably different than the current night sky, due to the motions of the galaxy. clearly, the heavens are not immutable.

    protoplanetary discs have been found around other stars. the layout of our own solar system, with the planets roughly on a plane, support the hypothesis. (similar orbital inclination)

    stellar nucleosysthesis is based on provable physics and mathematics. the spectrum also indicates the composition of stars.

    mutations can often be bad, but not always. if it gives an organism an advantage in survival, that will increase its evolutionary fitness, and the mutation will be spread.

    its very ironic that you say this. do you realize how dogs came to be? they're not from nature - nothing that friendly comes from the natural world. they were originally grey wolves. over thousands of years, they were domesticated by humans and bred for favorable traits, which is why dogs are loyal and friendly companions. intentional breeding is also why certain breeds have certain traits (guard dogs, companion dogs, hunting dogs, etc). other examples of this include cows descending from aurochs, and modern corn being far more fulfilling than the natural ancestral plant.

    it's not that simple.
    Mutation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    it selects certain genes and traits based on fitness. over many generations, this can create new species.

    lol, I don't mean to. you asked for information about all this stuff, and I supplied a basic walkthrough. I can't be sure of what your background is in these topics.

    this is not all based on assumption and speculation. there are fossil records, research, observations, cross-referencing, and more. it is a rational system which clearly explains the vast diversity of life, as well as the common traits found in otherwise very different life (dna, rna, proteins).

    when you discuss the cosmos, then you're getting into even harder sciences. in all of these fields, there is a great deal of information generated from rigorous study.

    evolution is not a "state protected religion", lol. it is simply the strongest theory that exists. if you can topple it, go ahead! science would love for you to do that, that's how it functions and grows. it is very different from religion - religion articulates certain tenets and structures of belief and leaves it at that. while it CAN change after it is established, it is very resistant to this. even its etymology agrees with that:

    re - latin for "past", "back"
    ligare - latin for "to bind"

    thus, religion binds you to the past.
    test
  13. x calibur

    x calibur

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    I also give the benefit of the doubt. ill have a look at those threads.
    test
  14. Sir Bustalot

    Sir Bustalot I am Jesus

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    I fucking cant stand he big bang theory

    sheldon is lame as fuck
    test
  15. breathlesss

    breathlesss Registered Sex Offender

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    that fucking blasphemy Busta, that show is great
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  16. breathlesss

    breathlesss Registered Sex Offender

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    and the doctrines of this church are the Nag Hammadi
    fuckin' killer jesus, walkin' out the womb, healin' babies and putting another on the cross for him, yea... they were already flawed 200 or so years after Jesus, add another 1800

    but, at least the nag hammadi focuses much much more on the philosophical life lessons of jesus rather than the irrelevant reverent history
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  17. eashaya

    eashaya seer

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    I’m sorry, sir. You are either desperately ignorant or lack any capacity to comprehend and understand what is written. You’re certainly interesting, though as curious as you may be it would be wise for dare I say no one to take you seriously at all.
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  18. MissAndrya

    MissAndrya Evolution is what is.

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    Seriously? I dare say he makes a lot more sense than both you and Coup (or, is it one and the same? You both spout the same shit) put together. Believe what you want, but quit your bible quoting, Jesus loving, God preaching, condescending bullshit. Nobody's buying it. You may be informed, but it's entirely with the wrong information (lies).
    test
  19. eashaya

    eashaya seer

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    You’re entitled to your opinion, however nonsensical and devoid of fact his arguments may be. I daresay I’ve produced many conclusions through nothing but logical inquiry absent of any scripture whatsoever, with evidence and fact supporting said conclusions. Inasmuch as you’re obviously incapable of understanding this (or unwilling to), you’re equally susceptible to allowing your preconceptions to incorrectly formulate your opinions and posts. Nevertheless, I will entertain your thought process for nothing less than goodwill should you not be able to show me the fallacy of my understanding. So please, MissAndrya, present to me what you believe to be nonsensical and logical, not to mention evidence of my “bible quoting, Jesus loving, God preaching, condescending bullshit.” We shall even ignore the fact that my post, which you quoted, was a direct response to Breathless’ false assertion regarding the original assembly (read Church) of believers in Christ; which you failed to address and/or quite obviously know nothing about. By the way, please enlighten me with your “theory” when you’ve advanced it beyond the beliefs presented by numerous, far more learned and astute scholars and scientists, for several decades now. In anticipation I shall wait. Good day and God bless.
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  20. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    True that. I havent seen any scripture used in any of the rebuttles
    test
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