The Dawkins Delusion

Discussion in 'IntroSpectrum' started by Yahunyahti, Apr 9, 2007.

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  1. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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  2. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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  3. arrogant british man? hes not arrogant becaus he disagrees with people like you
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  4. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    Like jerry springer, here are my final thoughts...

    The faithful are not about unity they're about dividing. Look at America.
    Look at the UK, Did you know the UK has Religion in schools now? The
    secular concept, seperation of church and state, is being outnumbered by the theocrats heavily. The four fathers lothed what we today refer to as the American-taliban. Look at history instead of reling on legends, Hitler himself grew up catholic, never formly renounced his catholicism and throughout adult hood remained religiosity, people also don't know that the nazi belt buckles were inscribed with "gott mit uns" Meaning "God with us." And Dawkins uses science to calculate the probablity of there being a god or of there being no God ... he does not Jump to irrational conclusions. The religiosity Jump to irrational conclusions, go on their whims, subconsciousely manifest God, and relie on defult logic to fill in science gaps. That's not science! And I agree with dawkins the statistical probablity of God not existing is practically sound. And the so-called spirit is nothing more than the Nervous system at work.

    Few things before I departure this thread...

    Hitler quote from Mein Kampf : "I sank down on my knees and thanked heaven out of the fullness of my heart for the favour of having been premitted to live in such a time" Written once he heard of the declaration of the first world war.

    Hitlers religious postion during the time of the Final solution:

    "My feelings as a christian points me to my lord and Saviour as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a christian and as a man I read through passage which tells us how the lord at last rose hin his might and seized the scourge to drive out of the temple the "Brood of vipers" and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the jewish poison. Today, After two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated , but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice ... and if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a christian I have also a duty to my own people."

    Notice the term "Brood of vipers" Hitler either picked that up from reading: At The Diet Of Worms by Martin luther. Or read it directly from Matthew 3:7, as Luther himself did as well.

    "Hitler returns to jewish persecution by God's will in Mein Kampf: Hence today I "believe" that I am acting in accordance with the will of the "Almighty creator": By defending myself against the jew, I am fighting for the work of the lord."

    Hitler wrote that in 1925 and said it again in a speech at the reichstag in 1938, and said many similar things like it throught his career.

    Senator, Berry Goldwater, in 1981...

    "There is no position on which people are so immovable as their religious beliefs. There is no more powerful ally one can claim in a debate than Jesus Christ, or God, or Allah, or whatever one calls this supreme being. But like any powerful weapon, the use of God's name on one's behalf should be used sparingly. The religious factions that are growing throughout our land are not using their religious clout with wisdom. They are trying to force government leaders into following their position 100 percent. If you disagree with these religious groups on a particular moral issue, they complain, they threaten you with a loss of money or votes or both. I'm frankly sick and tired of the political preachers across this country telling me as a citizen that if I want to be a moral person, I must believe in 'A,' 'B,' 'C,' and 'D.' Just who do they think they are? And from where do they presume to claim the right to dictate their moral beliefs to me?And I am even more angry as a legislator who must endure the threats of every religious group who thinks it has some God-granted right to control my vote on every roll call in the Senate. I am warning them today: I will fight them every step of the way if they try to dictate their moral convictions to all Americans in the name of 'conservatism."

    United states was not founded as a Christian nation, as seen in the treaty with Tripoli, drafted in 1796 under George washington and signed by John Adams in 1797....

    "As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of musselmen; and as the said states never have entered into any war or act of hostility aginst any Mehomitan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."

    ^ Those opening words of this quotation would cause one hell of an uproar in today's Washington ascendancy. Yet Ed Buckner has convincingly demonstrated that they caused no dissent at the time, among either politicians or Public. It is in my view, that the Paradox we see before us today is due to the Secularism of the constitution. America is so tolerant of others that churches are running amuck!

    And Lastly, Jefferson, the probability Aethist/TAP-agnostic, perhaps said it best...

    "To talk of immaterial existences is to talk of nothing. To say that the human soul, God, are immaterial, is to say they are nothings, or that there is no God, no angels, no soul, I cannot reason otherwise....Without plunging into the fathomless abyss of dreams and phantasms. I am satisfied, and sufficiently occupied with the things which are, without tormenting or troubling myself about those which may indeed be, but of which I have no evidence."
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  5. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    I completely renounce the hackneyedness of the nonoverlapping magisteria conception, I loath Theologians thinking they can explain things Science yet can't but soon will. Theology isn't even a teaching tool, it's an outlandish make it up as you go along absurdity. Moreover, Once you think about what breathes life into the equations, and actualized them in a real cosmos, it becomes hilarious! because if indeed they lie beyond science, they most cenrtainly lie beyond the province of theologians as well. Even the Warden from Oxford said: "I have grave doubts as to whether theology is a subject at all." After all, What expertise can theologians bring to deep cosmological questions that scientists cannot? NONE! Once we move outside the realm of science, They recommand chaplins? Why the chaplain? Why not the gardener or the Chef? Exactly, Why are Astronomers so cravenly respectful towards the ambitions of theologians, over questions that theologians are certainly no more qualified to answer than Scientist/Astronomers themselves? it is a tedious cliche, And a fallacious one at that. Then the religiosity brings up... But Science deals with HOW questions, but only theology is equipped to answer WHY questions. And What in the fuck is a WHY question? Not every english sentence beginning with the word WHY is a legitimate question. Why are unicorns hollow? What is the smell of hope? Some questions just simplely don't deserve to be answered. No matter if the question is phrased in a grammatically correct English sentence that doesn't make it meaningful, or entitle it to our serious attention. Nor, even if the question is a real one, does the fact that science cannot answer it imply that religion can? NO IT DOESN'T!

    I shall depart this thread with a food for thought...

    In the history of ideas, there are examples of questions being answered
    that had earlier been judged forever out of science's reach. For example:
    In 1835, The french philosopher Auguste Comte wrote of the Stars: "We shall never be able to study, by any method, their chemical composition or their mineralogical structure." Yet before comte's inked words from his pen could dry, Fraunhofer had begun using his spectroscopy to analyse the chemical composition of the Sun. Now spectroscopist daily confound "comte's ignorance" with their long-distance analyse of the precise chemical composition of even the most distant stars.
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  6. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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  7. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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  8. Offbeat

    Offbeat New Member

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    scientific fact dosen't equate to truth

    it basically equates to observation that fit accepted theory
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  9. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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  10. yet you get mad if Dawkins says you're full of shit for believing in something without conclusive evidence of its existence?
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  11. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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  12. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    This is such an ad nauseum argument! Did you really just ask what does the catholic church have to do with God? You also stopped reading after the catholic church part didn't you? How is it a fallacy when it is true? Your diatribe makes no sense! It means this my ridiculously inquiring simpleton, This God Belief has created centuries of ill-zeitgeist! Keep my argument in it's proper context, thanks!


    Actually the evidence of natural selection is over whelming Compared to
    your God/ID which relies on no evidence and defualt logic.I thought I explained the evidence in three threads ago? Did you neglect to read it? probably! The question now is where is your evidence? WHERE IS IT? NOWHERE! You don't have the Statisics, chemistry, rationale, or natural selection to back anything you say. Talk about Emotional appeal, Noone has disproven natural selection. Some have tried but failed. You lack knowledge in understanding the intermediate stages of natural selection. Just because science hasn't soundly explained something yet like megauniverses and can only give probabilty to god not existing while offering alternatives such as natural selection, and inflation, doesn't mean that science won't be conclusive in the future as the techology advances... Honestly azues, Circular reasoning with Defualt Logic?, please! Exactly what can you provide besides a fulmination of Rubbish? Nothing! Where is this creator who created your God? You'll never be able to answer that question. You are a meme of religiosity. And lastly, Aliens are not reasonible or unreasonible to Dawkins, He is merely stating quite clearly Unlike God probability for Alien existence has been provided, Where as God has none. And yes, Dawkins is something of a mathematician, a furturist, who can realize by looking retrospectively at history, that all Scientific technology advances to give answers to things ignorant minds otherwise thought impossible. Why don't you write a letter to Dawkins? I'll bet he laughs at it!



    How can you be such a polemicist, and absent minded, to think we can not? Your regressing gusto can only be compared to someone on soma! Not just logical arguments but natural selection as well. It's not about fathoming its about probability. And the religioisty do not have a Leg to stand on. Where as Dawkins has probabilty of God not existing as I've explained and shown figuratively speaking like a MILLION TIMES Already!



    What is religioisty? Besides a placebo pill for those who don't want to learn and understand? You however do not have a Logical or reasoning mind. Therefore, you create polemicist slippery slope arguments, What if we're all like you? What if science never progressed? What if Quantum mechanics & natural selection are the key to answering the megauniversal question? Are you suggesting we relie on defualt logic and skyhookery? I'll choose to be neo and unlock the mystery, you keep to the palcebo that religioisty is perscribing.

    You're whole illogical arguement rest on not scientifically observing and blindly labeling everything God. By this illogic of never scientifically observing or expermenting with different alternatives of science... The Milky-way, orion's belt, eight planets (pluto doesn't count), would not of ever been found and scientifically explained or reexplained. Never heard of a Hubble Space Telescope? You think I don't notice the D.H.C in your diatribes? pffft, please!
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  13. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    No, I won't stop using either, they're good examples but you can't comprehend the context. This is the problem with religioisty mindsets. Is the religiosity trying to thwart freedom of speech now? The example wasn't about disproving God per se, You celestial mishap, It was about showing how men throughout the centuries have been responsible for almost every inhumane atrocity do to this God belief. If someone is a satanist, they would also have to prescribe to the God placebo as well. Which leads me to my next point, How come the religioisty never try to prove Satan? How can you attribute intelligence or talented skills to religiosity? you can't. just more defualt logic yet again.



    Do not tell me how to think about my argument, especially When you can't even comprehend it. My argument has been well thoughtout and presented for three weeks now. It has deducted your default logic time and time again, But you're ignorant, unreasonable, unwilling, to recognize this fact! You have not a leg to stand on.



    You must of missed the natural selection/megauniverse explaination. Natural selection is the alternative against blind God/skyhookery/defualt logic. Natural selection is backed by science, God is not! You on the other-hand, Also Have nothing to explain our existence or God's existence. You're a defult thinker! Just imbrace your lazy mind and leave the thinking up to scientist. You're nonsense is in the way. Plus, as Science technology advances everything will be fully explained and comprehended. How does default logic prove God again?


    How is he not a scientist? Because he won't confrom to the religioisty?
    Since when does a scientist have to be religious to be accepted as a scientist? More Insane logic from Taliban-america! He actually is a scientist, He even has a degree from Oxford.


    Darwinism has not been disproven. Noone has come close to disproving it.
    They've made illogical fallacious attempts, but they don't try to understand it therefore can't grasp it and make fallacies about it. there is plenty of evidence, You just want to believe there isn't any so you can keep people under your D.H.C placebo.

    evidence...

    "inbetween" species, the fossil record contains amphibian-like fishes, mammal-like reptiles, bird-like reptiles, and of course many species of extinct ape with shorter arms and longer legs than modern day apes (in terms of arm-to-leg ratios). So the many species of extinct primitive apes were more "human-like" in that respect than modern day apes are. And there's the dog-bears of the Miocene that preceded the later arrivals of both dogs and bears in the fossil record. There's also small four footed mammals that preceded the arrival of larger tapir, elephant and horse species in the fossil record. Tapirs, elephants and horses apparently shared a common ancestor. In fact, elephants and sea-going dugongs also shared a common ancestor as seen in the dugong's snout and the elephant nails on its front fins.

    Stop saying there is no evidence, The only one with no evidence is the religiosity. Don't let your mouth overload your ass! I'm sick of your demagoguery!

    Nice, ad hominem fallacy, Might as well, since you can't disprove him.
    And what do you call no evidence, defualt logic, and irrational thinking ...
    I call it your diatribe for God's existence! Where is your PROOF? Nowhere!

    What is it with you? Do you need the last word? Because honestly none of your long winded arguments make sense nor are they factual. You make all kinds of illogical questions and diatribes, but never do you provide answers. You're a Gap worshiper, and that's all you'll ever be, You're Lazy minded!
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  14. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    I can't stand your ignorance. Yes, you are full of shit.
    No Dawkins is not, You have nothing but default logic
    and bullshit diatribe.

    You've never even read Dawkins.


    Yes you do! LOL! LMAO! LMAO! DEAD!
    You're as bad as religion if not wrose.

    Stop telling people how to act, they are not going to listen to you. Theist are full of shit, it's just another form of creationism.

    Yet you can't share it with the rest of us? why don't you describe this experience? LOL@ this contradiction! WOW! "The difference is, I don't speak against people disbelieving in God" "I'm not on a mission to prove God's existence to anybody." Man, just Shut your mouth, You're such a loser doing a piss poor job at it anyway. You're logic is madness, It's a personal belief, And if it is personal why not keep that shit to yourself? Fucking american-taliban, I fucking swear!

    Mission from God? Yeah behide your computer.

    Where? All evidence must be experienced internally by each individual. LMAO! That is just comedy gold! You clearly do not know shit!

    Wait a mintue, isn't God suppose to be in everthing ?
    Where the fuck is satan by the way? All you can do is insult an educated man like Dawkins. Good luck with that!
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  15. can u imagine dawkins and yahunyahti having a conversation?
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  16. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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  17. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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  18. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    Attacking me not the conversation? Tsk, tsk, You certianly are a gamma!


    Mad? That's not an example for god existing that is dialectical prestidigitation.


    How do you know? You have personal conversations with God now?
    His religious scriptures sure do imply it.

    They are not evil, They are carring out God's wishes. The concept of what is evil is conditioned by "Hypnopaedia" in your society. I know you agree? How would you know what God supports and doesn't? Have you looked around the world today? Perhaps, Your God is like a roman who enjoys the colosseum. lol




    I don't know why your making the same lame redundant arguments. You haven't got anywhere with them. You've never read Dawkins either. He doesn't just explain the religions take on God, He explains All types of delusions of God. The man is a Genius. yeah I'ma lame duck, Yet you invent your own God because you need to keep control. Of what? I have no idea!


    Parrot? Quite funny seeing how everything you says revolves around Brave new world. Honestly azues, You want to be Huxley! you even try to pose like huxley in pictures. I don't think for myself? Everything I was think dawkins just reassured. Only thing I really got from him was a good understanding of natural selection.


    Yeah but in this case it is You pushing the God. And the Science dawkins gives is not False. So stick to being a Gamma getting emotional.

    I don't have to pin you. You've pinned yourself. You shouldn't conjure up complete bullshit you can't prove! Anyone wants to know the probabilty can read dawkins book.

    This is why you're dumb and unteresting to talk with, The point goes over your thick skull everytime. You are fucking retarded. Exactly, What does that have to do with my Point? Nothing!

    However, a full-fledged planet is an object that orbits the sun and is large enough to have become round due to the force of its own gravity. In addition, a planet has to dominate the neighborhood around its orbit. Pluto has been demoted because it does not dominate its neighborhood. Charon, its large "moon," is only about half the size of Pluto, while all the true planets are far larger than their moons. In addition, bodies that dominate their neighborhoods, "sweep up" asteroids, comets, and other debris, clearing a path along their orbits. By contrast, Pluto's orbit is somewhat untidy. And That's why Pulto is not a planet! LOL!



    No god is bullshit, Stop with the religiosity defualt logic and emtional appeal. Yeah so where is your evidence for God? All I see you doing is attacking different scienctifical theories like a moron inorder to reflect away from you having to to prove God.

    You can't and that is why you deflect the conversation.
    Kill yourself, Go incarnate with god, 12 in One, Right? LOL!
    You're so fucking lame!


    You're a piece of lying white trash shit, Noone cares what you think!
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  19. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    In what manner? Mocking you! So what get over it, pussy!
    Yes, you hate being wrong! Which explains why you can't see how wrong you are! You talk to much about nothing like the Warden from A brave new world.

    I'm Glad you're having a womenly snicker. Now If I could just get you to kill yourself. This coming from a guy who trys to pose in pictures like Huxley? Choke on Alex jones dick!

    Yes you do. LMAO! and actually You butt in because your wrapped mind thinks they're dissing you as well. Why can't someone who acknowledges the possibilty of no God speak their peace without you getting emotional? Write a letter to Dawkins, He will tear you apart in a matter of seconds. Even Faster than I did! Unlike you he does have empirical evidence through Biology! Please, explain your empirical evidence for God again?


    My name is Azues, Yes, I'm a nazi! I recommand noone read books which argue there is no God. Do not read those kind of books, those Books are bad! Burn those books! How can you say anything to anyone, When the fact is you think your Huxley? LMAO! Do I say don't read Huxely? Do I? No! Azues, That might be how you study something then regurgitate it, But that isn't how I study things...I don't just agree with everything I read like you do ethier. I actually study it, I reread it over and over, highlight parts to remember, and make my own notes. Noone is creating frankenstiens, We're speaking our minds and you don't like it. Stop being lenina from the brave new world, trying to Tell others they can't say anything!


    Do you know what a theist is? it's the belief in the existence of one or more gods. So my statement stands Theist are full of shit. Who is being a Violent atheist who pertends to be a theist? You say the dumbest shit!

    Comprehendsion issues? LOL@ you trying to make something out of nothing! At least when I said you can't comprehend it was the truth! You're so lame! LOL! You want to be like me azues, I'm flattered! But I think the problem is you misinterpet everything! My mind is lacking? Yet you don't have rational thoughts! Funny!


    LOL@ this bullshit! I comprehended just fine. My Whole point of questioning you the way I did was to show how full of shit you are. You can't explain your experience with God. You're a lame motherfucker, Trying to say God for a few, but only if you believe, and if you don't believe your satan. You're trying to turn this into a Intological Argument. Peter pan says, You can fly if you just believe! So Are you gonna be dumb enough to jump off into the grand cayon? LMAO! Have someone Kill you, Meet your maker! Man the fuck up!
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  20. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    LOL! Spoken like a true cultist!

    Look at that religioisty mind set, You can't Scare me by saying, i'm in Hell.
    Come religiosity mindset, next you'll be saying Earth is purgatory! LMAO! EWWWWWWW, mysterious! OH Shit, You got me laughing!


    Prove it! You can't! Fuck that peter pan bullshit!

    No they will repeat what the Religiosity has indoctronated them to believe. They are religious memes prescribing to the God placebo!



    Now Your implying people of science are Satan without any proof. How Huxley of you to make the shit up as you go along. So your mind is Currupted? Because you can't see past the God delusion? So by this illogical claim, You're actually satan! How many satans are there? There are lot of dummies like you in the world satan must have little helpers? demons perhaps? LOL! perhaps! LOL!




    Hello, satan! LOL!



    I thought God was a Spirit, Why is God Associated with the mind all of sudden? LOL! Such religioisty dogma!


    ok, so a breeze is creating the motion through the trees. Why Would I disagree? Yes I would acknoweldge by observing the leaves on the trees that it is a breeze causing the movement. it's not the samething as proving God you Fucking doltish tool! I can witness the breeze doing it! That was the Stupidity shit you've said to date!

    Save it you Pseduo-intellectual, You don't speak for me. Go back to never never land, Where you belong. Join, micheal jackson! I finished with your stupidity! You're too stupid for me. I'm Out! And I'm not just saying that either, You really are too stupid!
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