Discussion in 'the Onslaught' started by DethStryque, Mar 16, 2012.
Michael was the G.O.A.T.
This is a good question but the answers it elicits vary because there is sooo much round to cover.
To me? I look at the primary categories of lyricism as defined and covered by a combination of poetry, music, prose...all the things that we find in Literature+all the components that we judge in hiphop. The quick answer--as I'm pressed for time--is to look at the categories provided in the RWZ. The more categories done well in a rap? The better the rap. There are also primary heavyweight categories...Punchlines, Personals, Rhyme Scheme...but all the rest of the categories are crucial too and the more you have in your rap? The better, fresher, more creative, more powerful the rap. Otherwise, one becomes predictable and eventually stale. Lacks creativity. The more knowledge you have, the more expansive and correct your vocab, the more more numerous, more unique, and more skilled your metaphor use...basically the more tools used well brought to your craft...the better your compositions MUST ALWAYS BE.
The RBL has the classic narrow scope approach. The largely unimaginative rhyme schemes, the predictable punches, the typical setup/punchline format...and the very very narrow definition of a punchline. As a result? It stifles itself. It kills itself with its monotonous sameness and it punishes creativity, knoweldge, and the use of the fine tools of the craft that only master craftsmen use...like sound manipulation. Like imagery, meta and simile. Like triple entendre. The RBL is very intolerant of all the ingredients needed to make it thrive and grow.
If the RBL was as solid and unperturbed by any competition? Then it would WELCOME competition. Truth? Many of the OTBVA guys were right. There is no difference between the way you WRITE your bars and the way you SPIT your bars...when you're sufficiently skilled in both to see the seamless overlap. Bars>jokes....but jokes ARE bars. The better lyricist is the lyricist that does everything well, not just a specialist who does one thing well. The better lyricist also can and does appreciate quality work from people who employ a style he/she doesn't prefer, and thus is a better judge than the nonlyricist.
The nonlyricist's insufficient arsenal and insufficient proficiency in that limited arsenal limits their growth, their appreciation of quality, and dooms them to eventual staleness and burnout. The lyricist's journey never ends because the lyricist constantly grows and expands. The lyricist sees that ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING IS A PUNCHLINE...but knows how to execute punchlines in fresh and unique ways using unusual subject matter. The lyricist expands their knowledge base, because the more knowledge the lyricist has? The more power and variety their bars have. The more they can communicate express and create.
Go back to the categories of this RWZ Guideline. Key say 12 bars. See how much of the categories in the RWZ Guideline are in your 12 bars. Judge the quality of your work in those categories. If you're missing categories? Craft bars that fit into your verse, make sense, and fill out the missing categories.
Watch how you crafted a verse that is better than anything you ever wrote in the RBL...every single time...cuz now you include the categories of lyricism and you do those categories well. That's also the proof of the superiority of lyricism; you do better with more tools. You get better and better with each tool and combine tools in newer ways and then you find and create more tools. Therefore, you always make better and better compositions and you'll neeeeveeer be as weak as someone who doesn't do what you do.
Comparing a RBL verse to a lyricist's verse is like comparing the stick figures of early caveman painting to The Mona Lisa, The Taj Mahal and The Cistene Chapel.
No, see this is where you're wrong. You can't make art into some checklist of things that need to be included; it should be an expression of creativ freedom.
You realize that RBL is a battle league, right? As in, you should diss your opponent as much as possible, hence, the more punches you can effectively put in your verse the better. Anyways, RBL has been this way since before your time; RBL isn't going to change because some nerd thinks that it isn't "lyrical" enough.
You don't get it. RBL isn't scared of competition; there are numerous other battle leagues, I'm sure. What I'm trying to tell you is that this idea is RSTL with a little RBL in it; or just some clone of RSTL. Why should there be competition between leagues on the same site? It makes no sense for us to be targeting the same groups of members, especially if those member are currently satisfied with the status quo.
You keep making the same argument, it's getting old. Good art is good of its own accord, not because it meets some arbitrary criteria.
If I want to do something like this I sign into RSTL tbh
So you don't like punchline battles, I get that, but... seriously.. wtf? RBL verses were never intended to be deep and or profound; you want to analyze verses, join RSTL. I have a feeling that you feel constricted in RSTL; maybe you can't handle the confines of set topics; maybe you can only write some random shit that comes to mind; some lyricist.
Wrong every whichway. I love punchlines, what I'm saying is that there are many kinds of punchlines. Look at all my battles; chock full of punchlines but DIFFERENT KINDS of punchlines. The kinda punches that nonlyricists lack the knowledge base, creativity and inclination to even try. There are more ways to diss your opponent than say he's gay and focus 95% on largely unimaginative personals. Not dissin heads in the RBL I'm just bein real here. And that limited perspective of theirs also is the reason why their votes suck.
The RWZ is not at all like the RSTL; our topics are far more inclusive than what we see in the [ absolutely wonderful ] RSTL which I like a whole lot. The style of topics that the RWZ uses are called FLEXES and they cover lots more ground than what we see in the RSTL. Joints like Eminem's STAN and Beanie's I CAN FEEL IT IN THE AIR are FLEXES. 50 Cent's IN THE CLUB, GAME'S 300 BARS, RAKIM's LYRICS OF FURY are all FLEXES. That approach and style is wholly absent in the RSTL. That's why we're not competition to them and THAT'S GOOD cuz I LIKE THE RSTL. The RWZ includes Open Mic heads and Cypher styles too which the RBL is too limited to accept. The RWZ is not in competition with the RBL...the RWZ is for a different style and higher caliber--much higher caliber--of lyricist.
Your contention that categories limits art is silly. If that was the case? Nobody could JUDGE a battle. You have to know what to categories comprise an endeavor or you couldn't do it and you couldn't recognize it. What separates rap from poetry? Specific categories and ways of doing things do. Your position is manifestly wrong every whichaway. I feel where you're coming from but your worries and concerns aren't valid in this situation and that's good.
You still don't get it. A verse could be incredibly creative and not have a punchline; a verse could flow perfectly and not have any multi's.
Are you makaveli?
lmfao @ flexes. Just stfu. You still haven't defined what the fuck you mean by lyricism btw. A voting guideline is simply that, a guideline, not a definition.
How is this not RBL + RSTL? An open mic is an RSTL verse with an open topic. I feel like I'm arguing with Coup.
Lyricist expand the imagination of word manipilation to wow the audience, by breaking dwn a phrase, sentence, situation or even meaning of a word.. to create a more challenging and deeper impact than jst merely rhyming coherently. More than jsta storyteller and punchline conducter.
Lyricist: Rakim, Nas, Wu Tang, Krs-1, Loaded Lux, Canibus and Big L etc.
Rapperz stick to a simplistic formula for the money and really dont have any desire to challenge thmslvz to expand their lyrical capabilitiez. Most of the time, their lyricz have no depth, but are very catchy.
Rapper: Soulja Boi, Lil Wayne and 50 Cent etc.
Hybridz provide the audience wth both. Not only are their rhymez catchy, but deeply meaningful, creative and intricate. They look to challenge their audience lyrically, get their pointz across n such a way, that they can also make lotz of money while doing so.
Hybrid: Jay-Z, Biggie, Tupac, LL Cool J and DMX etc.
"Dumbed down to my audience, doubled my dollars,
Criticize me for it, but they all yell holla,
If skills sold truth be told, I'd probably be,
Lyrically Talib Kweli,
Truthfully I want to rhyme like Common Sense,
I sold 5 mil'... I ain't been rhyming like Common since,"
Song Cry might be the first meaningful track Jay did.
Anyways, your whole post is proof you're a total nerd.
Nerdz are smart, thankz for the compliment.
The "Reasonable Doubt" and "Fade To Black" LP, hasa lot of MEANINGFUL, DEEP AND CREATIVE LYRICZ n it.
Except you're borderline retarded; so I'll just call you an imbecilic, socially inept excuse for... I don't even know. You have braved the depths of lame and discovered unfathomed levels of faggotry. You make Forrest Gump look like he has a doctorate from MIT in Astrophysics. Your IQ < 0. Don't talk like you're smart. It was a really smart idea to post a picture of you in a public restroom; you're a transient sasquatch. You look like a couch surfing version of Harry and the Henderson's. You're the ugliest man on earth.
Ur a grown man.. who took a sober picture wtha tearra on his head.
U look like The Count from Sesame Street and Eddie Munster.
Ur perception of Ugly & Beautiful, Ill & Weak, Good & Bad has vertigo.
Your name shoulda been Easy E tbh
You sound like Double
Love that movie!
Gee.. I dont HEAR anythng on the TEXT side. Conscience fucking wth u?
U really took the time out of ur non-busy day to make that? Lol thanx.
Bad: Died of aidz.
Good: Had 7 kidz from 7 different fine women, and was a sex symbol before he died. Lol
Whn it comez to lookz comparisonz.. u suck at making me look bad.
That took like 5 minutes, if that. And you're admitting you look like a man
Separate names with a comma.