Polygamy & Islam

Discussion in 'IntroSpectrum' started by Thrilla-Ali, Mar 17, 2007.

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  1. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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    Look, if you don't have the integrity to admit that what Mohammed did was wrong, just say so and we can end this conversation. That's why I have a hard time getting along with Muslims. You refuse to admit what your own books say. Consummating a Marriage means to have sex. It is that simple. That is what it means. There is no way around it. He slept with a 9 year old. Your religion is based off a Pedo's visions while he was alone in a cave. Doesn't it seem odd to you that he was "forced" to receive the message and thought himself possessed at first?

    Seriously?

    Not one other prophet has ever thought he was possessed by demons.
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  2. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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    In case you pretend like you missed it. ^

    I wish you would just be honest for once. I wish I could encounter just one Muslim who was honest about his beliefs. But you aren't. You aren't because you are ashamed of your prophet. You know that your prophet was a pedophile and it embarrasses you and so you deny it.
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  3. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    No, you're a satanic liar. The primary meanings are defined as:

    Dictionary.com

    1. to bring to a state of perfection; fulfill. (fulfill the engagement by marriage rex?)
    2. to complete (an arrangement, agreement, or the like) by a pledge or the signing of a contract: The company consummated its deal to buy a smaller firm.



    He consummated the engagement by marrying her, it's crystal clear. And I know for a fact jews in biblical times married off their children at 12. That was the age, don't lie.

    "In most times, including biblical, marriage was a man's way of claiming his property (his women). Marriage was based on a financial arrangement with the girls father and had nothing to do with love. A man (who was at least age 12), could buy as many wives (as long as at least age 13) as he could afford and support, as well as concubines (breeders)."

    http://www.libchrist.com/bible/whymarriage.html


    And FYI, the age when boys become men is 13 and the age when girls become women is 12.


    He was never possessed by "demons" elaborate as to what you're talking about. Most of the things you bring up are either unauthentic or misunderstood or just weak in argument
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  4. MC VeXeD

    MC VeXeD New Member

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    .....of course i knew you'd do exactly what u did..... turn me into the bad man

    let him without sin cast the first stone...

    we are talking about a time before the car..... before kiddie porn and all the things u know in your daily life.....ALL OF THEM
    I wonder if u speak your views, or views u've heard by others that seemed logical to you at that point in time

    all u can see is an old man getting a nut

    as any base person would see

    the question should be why did he do this

    rather, you criticize someone you've never met as you've done with me
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  5. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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    Now use that SAME dictionary and look up Consummating Marriage.
    It said, "He Consummated the Marriage" with her. Look it up yourself since you purposely ignore the truth.

    Consummating a task means to complete it.
    Consummating a marriage IS SEX. That is when the Marriage is complete or Consummated. That is why Marriages can be anulled if they are not Consummated. Dude, stop acting retarded. You're not this dumb.
    Perhaps it is just your pride getting in the way?
    Don't want to admit that Mohammed had sex with a nine year old?
    You have a better shot at justifying his action than denying it.


    Where is your evidence? The Quran?
    You know nothing about Jews but what your liars tell you.
    Your book is filled with lies about Jews.

    The Quran claims that Jews call Uzair a son of God. Who is Uzair? Jews don't call any man a son of God. Is Uzair supposed to be Ezra? No Jew calls Ezra the son of God. I don't know where Muslims get that bullshit, but it is exactly that. It is bullshit.

    Stupid Muslims just make shit up. The Quran says it so it must be true, huh?
    You show me one place where Ezra (Uzair) is called the son of God.
    No Jew would say that. This is the sort of made up shit I'm talkin about.

    You make up all kinds of nonsense and try to apply it. Do you know what a fuckin Bar Mitzvah and Bat Mizvah have nothing to do with SEX. They have to do with Torah studies you twit. Yes, the boy is 13 and the girl is 12 because girls mature mentally earlier than boys and are able to study Torah at that age.

    They don't marry them at that age.
    Jackass.

    What is your point. The world does not treat women like property today.
    So if Mohammed taught it for that time, it is no longer acceptable.
    If that practice can be thrown out, as it should . . . then others can.
    Islam cannot be perfect and eternally flawless, can it?
    The evolution of humanity requires, by necessity, the tossing out of the Quran as Islamic Law.

    Correct or Incorrect? Either you accept the Quran and Hadith as a whole or you throw it all out and write a new book and call it the Word of God.



    No, No, No . . . .

    They are NOT considered Men and Women you moron.
    That is Bar Mitzvah and Bat Mitzvah. It has nothing to do with marrying.
    You clearly do not know what you're talking about.
    Stick to Islam, you don't understand it either.


    They are not made up. I have provided Hadith for them all. You said that not all Hadith are good Hadith and so I provided verses according to what you call "Good" Hadith. You ignored that verse, like you always do and have once again deterred the discussion.

    Menaz is right about you. You don't seek the truth. You love your lie. It is comfortable for you.

    If you want the lie, then live a lie.
    I'm finished. I could be talking to somebody else with the time I'm wasting on you.
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  6. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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    I'm not saying that you're a bad man. The world was much different then. We are growing and evolving over time. To continue the process requires us to admit that the way they lived in the past (in many ways) was wrong. If we cannot do that because people are trying to be too liberal then we will become stagnant.

    Yes, it happened a lot.
    Yes, it was considered insignificant then.
    YES, it was wrong.

    We know more about a young girl's body today than they did.
    It is not good for a pre-teen to be having sex.
    It is that simple.

    There is nothing to discuss on this.
    Mohammed did things that no other prophet would have considered doing.
    He did things other prophets condemned people for doing.

    If you want to follow Islam, then follow Islam.
    This thread is for Muslims. If you are not a Muslim then stop responding as if you are. The purpose is to make Muslims question their views.
    If I were debating Christianity do you think this fool would support Christians? No, he would join in. If I were debating Jews would he defend them? No, he would join in. Every religion has its problems. I am not worried about you right now. I'm talking to Muslims.

    If you want to make a thread and have a discussion or a debate with me, then do it. But this is about Islam and this is for Muslims. Let them think for their self.
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  7. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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    It makes me crazy when Muslims try to say, "You're just misunderstanding it because the translation is bad."

    The translation is bad?
    Blame the King of Saudi Arabia.
    The Quran I have came from him.
    It was given as a gift by a friend of mine.

    I can read and there is nothing wrong with the translations.
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  8. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    [funny]

    Oh, and people can't consummate a marriage by taking vows? Or signing a marriage contract? Why does consummating a marriage automatically mean sex to you? To fit the criteria of your argument ofcourse.


    Go to www.dictionary.com and type the word consummate. Check the first two primary meanings of the word. Besides, the hadith was written in arabic, not english, so how do you know the true meaning anyways?

    I already explained this. Consummated does not mean sex. I already provided you the two primary meanings of the word, and by marrying her he consummated the marriage, because she was engaged to him earlier.
    Just look at the hadith, Aisha narrated: "the prophet engaged me when i was six, and consummated the marriage when i was nine" He married her when she was nine, genius

    http://thesaurus.reference.com/search?r=20&q=Consummate

    Remember, she said she was engaged to him at age 6, and he consummated the marriage with her at age 9 (in other words he married her at age 9)



    http://www.jewfaq.org/marriage.htm writes:

    "The minimum age for marriage under Jewish law is 13 for boys, 12 for girls; however, the kiddushin can take place before that, and often did in medieval times."

    "In most times, including biblical, marriage was a man's way of claiming his property (his women). Marriage was based on a financial arrangement with the girls father and had nothing to do with love. A man (who was at least age 12), could buy as many wives (as long as at least age 13) as he could afford and support, as well as concubines (breeders)."

    http://www.libchrist.com/bible/whymarriage.html

    "In Hebrew culture many married at age 13, died at age 30"

    http://www.libchrist.com/bible/adultery.html

    "Thirteen was the legal age for marriage (for males)"

    http://www.studiesintheword.org/biblical_marriage.htm


    ^ and there's a whole lot more evidence just sitting for me on the web. You certainly are a satanic liar, you little cry baby.



    They did in biblical times [funny]
    calm down there buds, don't wet your pants now.


    I never said it had anything to do with marriage you weak freak. I said that the meaning behind the barfmitzfa illustrates manhood and womanhood to a certain degree.
    And that the age of barfmitzfa in ancient times, was the legal age they married off their children.



    Yea right, you made phony claims that the prophet pbuh had intercourse with a married woman - that was a lie. She was divorced.

    You never came with any proof that prophet muhammad pbuh was "possessed" by a devil either, and I prompted you to do so in my last post

    [​IMG] Peaceout Jewpac
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  9. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    You can't read arabic though, and i don't think you can go anymore crazy then you already are, you nutcase.

    And one other thing.

    An Abraham (80+ years of age) pbuh had sex with a young maiden named Hagar to produce ishmail pbuh, does that make Abraham a pedophile too? Does that make you biblical homeboy "yeshua" illegitimate?

    Joseph (age 35-38) married Mary (12-14 years old) at such a tender age, does that make him a pedophile too?

    I'm not sure if muhammad pbuh had fornication with Aisha, but I'm sure it wasn't at the age of nine, because she grew to love him. My estimation would be around the ages of 16-19 if anything.
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  10. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    Told you man. I called him like I see him.

    four fallacies this kid does... you should ignore, and just keept on the subject until you get a straight answer.

    Lies.
    Over loads the conversation and switches subjects.
    Browbeats.
    And Copies and paste, almost every reply. (verses, I understand) but he post the imam opinions by copy and pasting and has no mind of his own. which shows he knows nothing, only what he is half assed told. I caught him trying this in my threads. And the replies he doesn't copy and paste, You can tell how low his IQ is. Hence, Advocating nothing is wrong with having sex with 9 yearolds. His sources are Shill's. His imam's are shill's. He is a shill.


    He can't conversationally debate where One thing is exaimed piece by piece. Which is how debate is carried out. He wants to Paste as many different subjects as possible in vast amounts so you feel overcomed and others can't pay attention to what is going on in the debate. it's a fallacy, Look it up in Philosophy. Ever notice he can never answer any questions. because he is copying and pasting shill Imam's. therefore, he can't answer the on going questions while staying on the same subject matter.


    And yes, Mohammad was a pedophile.
    And Thrilla, you Should know we have, Arabic to english dictionaries.

    Accept it.
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  11. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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    Is there even one Muslim anywhere on this planet who isn't Anti-Semitic?

    Probably not since your Quran promotes racism against Jews.
    Muslims forever stay hating Jews. Jealousy? Yep. Envy? Of course.


    *Shrugs*
    What can you do?
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  12. Yahunyahti

    Yahunyahti New Member

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    What does Hagar and Abraham have to do with Yeshua?
    Yeshua wasn't Abraham's son.
    [funny]

    Somebody is reaching.
    I already told you that Abraham, Moses, Mohammed and Paul were minor prophets. Yeshua, Buddha, Lao Tzu were major prophets. You just can't keep up.

    There is no way to know how old Mary was when she delivered Yeshua. Sources believe she was 16 because she left the temple at the age of 15 and was betrothed to Joseph to marry him when she turned 16. However, she became pregnant before she turned 16 and thus Christians (out of fear of believing that Yeshua was born of a woman who was not ceremonially married) claim she immaculately conceived.

    But wait, aren't you Muslim? Muslims don't believe Mary was married AT ALL.

    She was not 12-14 because young girls dedicated to the temple stayed there until the age of 15, at which time they were given a husband of righteous standing.

    Everything you say is altered and false.

    You're sure? How are you sure? Because you don't want to accept it?
    16-19? Aisha was 17 when Mohammed DIED! How would she have been 19 when he had sex with her? Are you able to speak the truth?
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  13. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    Azue, CHeck this out...

    I was reading my Hadith today and came across this.

    It's Authentic.

    Sahih Bukhari 5:58:235). "[T]he Prophet (Muhammed) married her (Aisha) when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine.

    You are correct.

    Also the Thing about Josphe is, The bible never said he was the babies daddy. If we Think logically with no proof at hand, All We know is a man had to have had sex with her, But we don't know who that man was because it's called a immaculate conception. Tell you this much it wasn't Gabriel either.
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  14. Virgo

    Virgo Let's go to war

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    This dude is not a real Muslim. I'm not a Muslim and I'm more of a Muslim than he is.


    True, his blood father very well may have been a Temple Priest who impregnated Mariam before giving her to Yosef (Joseph) to raise him. There are many possibilities. One thing is for sure, it wasn't God who knocked her up.

    Truth be told, it doesn't really matter who his blood father was. What matters is that a person be honest and admit that if he existed, he had a father. It amazes me that Muslims and Christians combined make up about 2 Billion in number. 2,000,000,000 people on this earth believe that God impregnated a young girl and created the miracle baby Jesus who walks on water and calms storms.

    It is mind blowing how stupid people can actually be.
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  15. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    You know what I think about jesus. The revolution is to make the christians accept it. The quicker they do the better their cirtical thinking will be on Political issues.

    I thought it was 3 billion?

    Everytime I go out they're everywhere.
    I've become so desensitize by their lethargic mannerisms,
    they Nolonger boggle my mind.
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  16. Anidawehi

    Anidawehi "-----"

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    I can't be a part of that revolution. Yeshua did exist and he did teach. He was a Sage (Wise Man) and did teach a message of Inner Peace (similar to what Buddha and Lao Tzu taught). The fact that he was willing to die to teach this message makes it impossible for me to deny his existence. It would be foul to deny the man's existence after he went through so much to teach people.

    The revolution is not to get Christians to deny Yeshua's existence, it is to get them to wake up to the truth of his existence and the truth in his message.

    Your revolution will not and should not be won. No offense.
    If they abandon the lies about the man and accept the man as a man, as he clearly was, then they will be able to analyze his message and toss out their rediculous belief that they are saved by his crucifixion. It amazes me that Yeshua taught inner peace and salvation through knowledge, love, compassion, etc. and then Saul changed his name to Paul, wrote a few letters and undermined everything Yeshua lived and died for.

    The Revolution is coming. If you want to be a part of it, then you have got to let some things go. You cannot prove that Yeshua did exist (as of yet) and you cannot prove that he did not exist. You are claiming to want people to rely on evidence, yet your revolution is dependent completely upon a lack of evidence against his existence.

    If Christians would view Yeshua (Jesus) in the same manner that they view Buddha, Lao Tzu or any other Philosopher from Aristotle to Socrates, then the problem would very swiftly be resolved. The goal is to bring Christians and Muslims back to earth and show them that Mohammed and Yeshua were human beings. They were not super-human. They ate, drank, had sex, shit and got sick like anybody else. They were just men. But if you try to tell a Christian that Jesus shit, they consider it blasphemy. Try it sometime. Find a Christian message board and ask Christians if they believe Jesus ever got a hard on or had a wet dream. I got banned from a Christian Message board just for asking, "Do you think Jesus ever got an erection?"

    Banned forever from the site for asking a question.



    That's why I avoid people as much as possible. I can't get used to them.

    You really should reconsider your approach to the revolution. You could really do a lot of good if you did. Let me know if you change your mind on what you're fighting for.
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  17. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    Jesus couldn't have existed, I've not read one thing or one piece of evidence to convince me. I've read the Historains, They got yeshua of Nazarth mixed up with other men named yeshua. I've read the disciples and Apostals, They are but Pseudopigraphical. Not to mention, No physical empircal evidence. Though in light of all this there is a part of me that remains Agnostic.



    Without a doubt, That is the first part of the revolution.
    Is it not better to be pateint allowing a little light in at a time?


    It must be won though, inorder to construct a society where it's the womens right to choose in Political issues such as Abortion. This way people can't minpulate God or jesus to become the deciders. the thought of being against Abortion and against homosexuals comes from the scriptures. These are just a few issues why my revolution for Logical and rational thinking must pervial. I can see my vision azue, the vision is of a future where frist century thinkers in twenty first century bodies nolonger have their hands on nuclear buttons.

    I am quite Agnostic on the issue at this point in time. However, friend, Remember no trace of Pyshcial evidence exist for jesus, which leaves us at a stand still. There is no evidence for Jesus but Pseudopigraphical folk tales and inaccurate historian accounts. But we've already had that conversation. We both know where one another stands for now. Do not wager too far, For that time is not here yet. You must take the revolution one step at a time. Our day of armageddon is not even close to near.

    By doing that, You are doing exactly what one-part of my revolution calls for in the death of religious dogma.


    are use to me though?

    I have not changed my mind yet, and Noone will make me change my mind. I will however with time view the situation, If the first part of my revolution does not work as intended I will fullfill my entire Promise.
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  18. Anidawehi

    Anidawehi "-----"

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    There is no empirical evidence for Buddha either.
    None for Lao Tzu. None for Socrates. Matter of fact, there is no evidence that ANY of the Biblical prophets actually existed. Nobody questions them. Why Yeshua? Seems a little suspicious to me that you single him out. You grew up Christian and are angry because you have a feeling of betrayal in you. I can feel it in your words. The world then did not do photos of people. There was no concept of empirical evidence back then and all of that aside, it doesn't really matter whether he was real or not. The message is what matters.

    To argue against his existence is just as meaningless as to argue for it. It simply is not important. At least not if you know what the message was that he spoke.


    Those were my words. And yes, this is the first part of the revolution. It is also the last. There is only one part to this revolution. You don't fully understand because you still hold many incorrect views.


    What makes you think that I support abortion or homosexual relationships? I don't support either one. We are not fighting for the same thing. I am fighting for truth. You are fighting for what you believe is the truth.

    You believe that homosexuality is only wrong if one believes in God. I don't believe in that concept of God (I do have my views of the creating force and you know what that view is). I don't believe that homosexuality is "wrong" . . . I don't believe anything at all about it. It is not "wrong" it is just "worthless." It is a waste of energy. It is a perversion of the mind. It is good for nothing more than wasting energy.

    The male and female body fit together perfectly. Together they transmit energy through sex and recreate life. That is the whole purpose of sex. Sex feels good because it is necessary for reproduction. If sex didn't feel good then we wouldn't want to reproduce. Two men cannot reproduce. Two women cannot reproduce. It is worthless by this definition alone. The penis projects energy and the vagina receives it. The penis is a positive charge and the vagina is a receiver. (Like a battery) The woman's breasts are a positive charge and the man's nipples are a negative charge (receiver). In pure sex, energy is not wasted. The sex energy moves from the man into the woman through her vagina and then leaves her body through her nipples and returns to his body through his nipples and continues in this flow and cycle. This cannot happen between homosexuals because it is not pure or natural. Horniness is natural. Homosexual sex is not. Just because animals do it, that does not make it natural. The female Praying Mantis will bite the male's head off after she receives him. Should humans do that? Why not, isn't it natural for animals?

    Abortion is big business and I do not support it for that reason alone. Planned Parenthood were the ones who started sex education in schools because they knew that it would create more pregnancies. When pregnancy rates climbed they claimed that they needed to change the approach and so they began teaching protection instead of abstaining (knowing full well that teaching protection is promoting sex). They went from saying, "Do not have sex until you're married," to "You should wait to have sex, but you won't so wear a condom." Why are the schools teaching sex education at all? Why is sex education their responsibility? Who gave them that authority? Planned Parenthood does not want people to avoid pregnancy, that would cost them millions of dollars . . . not to mention human fetus' which they use to make cosmetic products and other shit. The pregnancy rates skyrocketed from the 1960's to now. Sex Education played a MAJOR role in that, along with television and the media, etc. Now they are trying to take it a step further. They never stop. Now they want parents to send their daughters to them to abort their babies. What the fuck is wrong with people? Can you not see that you're being played. Your views about abortion wouldn't even exist if Planned Parenthood hadn't been created. Now you're fighting for it? Why? Why not fight to stop teen pregnancy by teaching parents to educate their fuckin children with morals. They shouldn't be fucking each other in high school. They're still kids. Enjoy being a kid.

    No, I am strongly against abortion.
    And don't ask me about rape victims because that is easy to solve. We need real solutions. If a man rapes a woman or molests a child, he should be put to death. That will stop rapes and stopping rapes prevents women from needing to abort a rape baby. Problem solved.

    Homosexuality means nothing to me either way. I am not for or against it.
    If they want to have sex, so what. I am against doctors helping them get pregnant. If they are unable to do it themselves, then adopt. If they don't want to adopt, then they shouldn't be parents. We have far too many orphans for people to be wasting $20,000 to make a baby that looks like them. Until all the children in America have a home, nobody in America should receive doctor's help in making a baby. Homosexual or straight.
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  19. Anidawehi

    Anidawehi "-----"

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    Menaz, you are not ready for a revolution.
    No offense.

    Your revolution doesn't exist. It is all in your head and it will stay there. It cannot and will not succeed. Some people need God, whether God is real or not. Some people need religion, whether religion is necessary or not. You know, as well as I do, that these people cannot function without it. They must be told what to do and for them to feel peace and happiness in life, they must have something that they believe in. That's all they want. That's all they need. That's all they will get.

    Your revolution will never happen, Menaz. You know why? Because you have not realized one thing. Everybody can't be you. You cannot be me. I cannot be them.
    For you, Religion and God are not necessary.
    For them Religion and God are necessary.

    You say, "Why can't you just accept good morals as good morals?"
    They say, "Why can't you just accept God as existing?"
    To you, they are stupid.
    To them, you are stupid.
    To me, you both are relying on faith. It just takes different forms. Your faith is in the "intellectuals" and their faith is in the "unseen" . . . Either way, neither of you follow the path of Knowledge and Science.

    The revolution that you are daydreaming about, would lead to Aldous Huxley's "Brave New World" . . .

    You cannot see the whole picture.



    I don't consider you an idiot. Misguided, sure . . . stupid, no.


    The revolution must be inside of you before it can be outside of you. That is the revolution you should be focused on. If you change, the world will change with you. If you do not change, the world will stay the same. The world cannot be fixed. It is perfect. If you try to fix it, you will fuck it up. Change yourself and you will see, society merely needs a few adjustments. A complete revolution is not necessary.
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  20. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    You have much to say, If I have learned anything in my 23 years it is to listen.
    However, I will not continue to read long rants.

    So you admit there is no empirical evidence for buddha?
    So you admit there is no empirical evidence for Lao Tzu?
    Nor any for Socrates? however, Plato did exist, it is said Socrates is just a creation of Plato's mind. Azue, I didn't grow up christian, my family was abunch of free thinkers.

    To you it is meaningless, To me the bibles message will always be Misinterpreted.




    Of course those are your words, I said them for a reason. What better way to make you understand the revolution completely. Don't become a demagogue azue.




    What makes you think I was talking about you azue?
    There are 2-3 billion other christians.
    However, You don't fall far from the tree because...
    A.) Christians don't support abortion.
    And B.) Chrsitians don't support homosexuals.
    And you ask me what the problem is with the scripture?

    What I believe is the truth? Wrong, I am fighting for the truth.
    Do not discredit me friend, Unlike you I don't fellow scripture as a Belief.
    So who is following a belief for truth?

    Now you are going to tell me what I believe? This is the problem with years of religious indoctrination those sentiments "of gay bashing" get embedded in the minds of even non-christians. Because Day in and day out that dogma is spewed.
    Do you honestly think I want to worry about Revivalist rebels attacking me after the first revolution is over? I don't need those worries.

    Homosexuality is not a perversion of the mind.
    That type of thinking falls right in line with religious dogma.
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