Discussion in 'Overtime: Off-Topic Discussion' started by reznick, Jun 19, 2010.
He's talking about America Today. It hink.
Whose OUR culture?
None of us, unless we are black, and cannot trace further back than slavery, is the pure American culture. So no, that does not mean their culture is our culture.
Your culture, unless you cannot trace back further than your family in America, is mixed between American influence, and whatever your nationality is.
I was born in America. But my culture is mixed. America and Syria both influence my life and culture.
"i dunno man, i could trace my family history to back before a black person even stepped on american soil"
and? I dont understand where this falls into the discussion.
ya i mean but the culture today is derived in certain aspects at least from european cultures in a shape or form aint it? the sports u play etc
i dunno i don't really know enough to make an argument haha i'm just curious
Ask yourself what is America?
America is a piece of land that people from all countries all around the world traveled or immigrated to, in search for a new life.
Together, each person, ethnicity, race, all come together to form America, and it's culture.
Nobody embodies the entire American culture 100%, except for African Americans who cannot trace back their lineage.
*All of their influence, has come from America, therefor their culture is American, and American culture is them.* - this is probably the best way I can put it
You got it
And I speak on a very general level. Of course there are instances where this idea isnt so black and white.
Lets say a black African shares his cultural knowledge to a african american, and the african american decided to live the rest of his life according the his original culture in Africa. Then its not so easy to identify and analyze.
But on a very general level, I think my theory hold some truth
I don't get the logic of this. Even though an African American might not be able to trace his lineage back to a specific village or even a country, it's unlikely that he's completely unaffected by the cultural traits etc. of his ancestors. So yeah, there is definitely a direct influence. And on the other hand, it's not like poor Irish or Italian folk were able to swing by the motherland once a month to keep up with the latest in leprechauns and pizzas.
What your saying is basically that black culture was completely reset after coming to America and being subjected to slavery. That's ridiculous. I still agree that descendants of slaves of first generation immigrants can be said to have a more pure American culture, though.
i think i kinda understand em, obviously it makes less sense to someone who isn't american tho
on an offnote i hate them terms african american n suchlike haha. i suppose them terms are part of your cultures n shit but they sound stupid as fuck to me, like u don't call white people european americans namean, always wondered about that. or is it just one of them things that has stuck
i see what your saying.
I mean i guess i understand what your saying.... Like myself i can trace myself bakc to Africa (among other places) But i can only officially go back to my grandfathers grandfather who was a runaway
i've known people that have had similar beliefs regarding this, and although i do support the essence of what you're saying superficially, i think its just a nice way of saying that black people in america have less culture than everyone else.
in the time black people have been in america, they have cultivated a deep and rich culture within america, and that culture to me is american culture. but american culture is just a little more inclusive than only black culture. theres alot of areas of americana that black people in general are not active in. at least not predominantly. america (blacks, whites and everyone else) has always marginalized african american culture tho, and thats that.
thats a tricky one though. i should give it some more thought.
"I don't get the logic of this. Even though an African American might not be able to trace his lineage back to a specific village or even a country, it's unlikely that he's completely unaffected by the cultural traits etc. of his ancestors. So yeah, there is definitely a direct influence."
But wouldnt you agree that the African influence is no more than the European infuence.? Just because there is a touch of African culture in someone, it doesn't mean they're culture is only African, just because it was the home land.
Americas culture is Europe, Africa, Asia, South America. All of these cultures come together to form the American culture, which is the ultimate melting pot of the world. So and African American doesn't have to be "completely unaffected by the cultural traits" for him/her to fall under my theory.
Does that clarify it?
African culture, is part of the huge melting pot culture of America, so for an African American to have some African culture traits, it means no more than them having European cultural traits.
See the first paragraph of you response is wrong
but in the net paragraph you corrected yourself, and explained my intentions.
I think my theory should give black americans more power. If everyone in America thought liek this, then they would think much higher of black america.
Were on a hiphop board so its hard for some of us to understand the racial stigma, but if every racist American thought about it this way, I believe black americans would have more power and influence in this country.
My entire point to this is...
rather than thinking of Uncle Sams picture, when someones mentions America
You should think of a prominent black figure.
The most powerful country in the world is America. And I think the most American people in the world are African Americans. And they deserve to have that standing in peoples minds, considering what they had to sacrifice and go through.
you, my friend, just killed me
Lol i'm surprised you didn't say it.
although some of the op is logical, the part about american blacks not being connected or influenced by their african heritage is insulting.
there are many jamaican slave descendants who's entire belief structure is based on ethiopia's king. I would think a black population anywhere's culture would be predominantly afro-centric. I cant draw a family tree or tell you my great great grandparents name either and Im whitey.
I never meant to be insulting, and I honestly don't think my reasoning is insulting whatsoever. I mean nothing negative by this. I'm just trying to make you guys think in a way I never thought before.
As far as I know, the main cultural thing that slaves brought from Africa were the songs. Because they still sang a lot of the songs from their homeland.
But I think it would be more insulting to insinuate that a singing style is enough to identify them as African, because cultures and their complexities extend much further than that.
I think my line of thinking, right or wrong, is empowering, not insulting.
what if there was, and always had been only white people in america???
that would be fucking weird.
yeah. honestly, its a tough topic for me to wrap my puny brain around man. culture is phenomenonal, and i believe american culture is a complex conglomeration of sub-cultures.
but still, i feel that if their was a heirarchy of influential ethinicities of our american culture, that black people have been here almost as long as white people and thus, share that influence.
i agree with what your saying in several ways, and it reminds me of my disapproval with people (both black and white) who marginalize african american culture. to me african american culture, just is american culture, and vice versa.
alot of black people are very possessive of african american culture but are subscribers to american cutlure, and the same goes for a lot of non-black americans.
i cant pretend to be an authority on any of this 'cause in reality, i'm just a "po' black man trying to make it in the world" (real shit), but i think that if more people thought in the way you've described, it would eliminate alot of social impasses.
but i hear you tho mayn.
my g/f is asian and latina, and has strong feelings about white america. she feels that white americans have no culture. i disagree with her on that, but she insist that white america's culture is to steal other cultures. she points to how just about every karate dojo is ran by white people. because she's not black she gets away with saying more racist things than i would ever say, but in a way she has a point too. culture just a really complicated thing.
and like I said, your right, its not a simple black & white issue(no pun). Theres gray areas everywhere
but in the general scheme of things,
" african american culture, just is american culture, and vice versa. "
its crazy I just never really thought about it that way before, and I think its a great topic for someone to write a book on, even though it had to have been done before
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