Is anyone still on Shogun's war wagon?

Discussion in 'MMA, Boxing & Other Combat Sports' started by SeeSon, Jan 17, 2009.

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  1. Mac Sabbath

    Mac Sabbath New Member

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    I know, I just think keyboard warriors act like steroids explain everything. It's a blind, lazy conclusion.

    Actually, the proof so far is that steroids don't help MMA guys much at all. Just about anyone worth mentioning that tested positive lost their fight. Many, such as Sean Sherk, came back and looked about the same. Cro cop was accused of taking steroids because he wasn't doing great in America, only to go back overseas and look just as bad.

    Not only that, they hinder the weight cutting process.

    Injuries, ring rust, wear and tear, new environment, and deeper talent rosters are the better explanations for most pride guys losing these days.
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  2. Mac Sabbath

    Mac Sabbath New Member

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    Oh, and technically, Shogun's cardio was worse against Griffin.

    Discuss.
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  3. OurSin

    OurSin lol @ equality

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    I don't think shogun cuts weight to make 205 does he? steroids won't make a bad fighter good, but they will make a good fighter great.......

    I would never say cro cop was on roids......he looks about the same to me, he just was overated IMO.....

    Shogun looks like 2 different people......then again, he's claim to fame is the head stomp and soccer kick......his whole game plan is illegal in the states......i guess he wasn't very good at much else?
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  4. SeeSon

    SeeSon New Member

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    Durabolin Nandrolone Decanoate Anabolic Steroids Profile

    Here's an article detailing the positives of steroid use.

    1. Steroids aid in helping a fighter recover from injuries.
    2. Steroids allow a fighter to recover faster so the "wear and tear" would be drastically lessened.
    3. Weight cutting is irrelevant for guys like Shogun and Wand when they are light for that weight class. Steroids would probably give them an advantage in that they wouldn't need to drain themselves by cutting weight and would still feel just as strong as other fighters who are naturally bigger but drain themselves by cutting weight.


    So in all actuality it is almost as if the "keyboard warriors" have more evidence to support their claim while yours comes off as "blind and lazy" [dunno]. Just sayin
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  5. Mac Sabbath

    Mac Sabbath New Member

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    It does have side effects that can be bothersome in hypersensitive individuals, such as acne, excitation, insomnia, nausea, diarrhea and bladder irritability(1). More serious (and common) side effects include testicular atrophy (shrunken balls), impotence (deca dick) and gynecomastia (bitch tits)

    Well, I gotta say, these things don't sound very useful for a fighter to experience. I'm also pretty sure none of the accused fighters have ever seemed to have acne, stained athletic wear, or droopy bitch tits. I know Wandy has kids, and I've seen Shogun's wife. And since they've taken so many steroids, it'd be stupid to say they never dealt with any side effects. I mean, we're assuming they show all the positive effects, so let's not conveniently rule out the negative.

    ha@ weight cutting is irrelevant. Man...

    Steroid Pros and Cons - Positive Effects of Anabolic Steroids and Side Effects of Steroid Use

    Increased muscle mass / weight

    Seems kinda counterproductive to the weight-cutting procedure[dunno]

    I won't even say they've never taken steroids. In fact, in all likelihood they have (as well as many of their opponents) but it's silly to attribute all past success and current problems to steroids without even considering things like ring rust, wear and tear, psychological effects of injuries, and a little thing called being burnt out.

    Especially since:

    - Wanderlei's cardio is better than it's ever been.

    - Wanderlei's downfall began in Japan. He even lost to Vitor and Tito overseas.

    - Shogun finished Overeem and Randleman in the US of A.

    But, let's conveniently ignore those little facts, because he's gassing! Steroids!
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  6. SeeSon

    SeeSon New Member

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    You make good points. I will concede that at the end of the day its inconclusive and we will never know. The only thing I took and take offense to is that you make the assumption that anyone that believes he took steroids is ignorant, blind and lazy when there is at least enough circumstantial evidence to lead people to that conclusion, but I'm done with this discussion.
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  7. Mac Sabbath

    Mac Sabbath New Member

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    I know it probably came out that way, but it's not really what I meant. It's basically a guarantee that there's quite a bit of juicing going on in Japan, but I think people (sherdoggers, mostly) go overboard with it. Not just the old pride guys, but even Overeem now. It's almost useless for a fighter to fight overseas now because if they succeed it must be due to substances.

    As for Shogun, he was a little overrated to begin with because Pride rules suited him. I mean, what if this was pride and he soccer kicked Coleman the first time he was down? Fight would've been over, and people would've been on his nuts. I kinda wonder if success got to his head a little. But if he looks bad against Chuck, win or lose, I say send him to the 3rd rate promotions with his brother.
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  8. ProFane

    ProFane dB's Finest

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    I rarely throw out that accusation unless i see something that really makes me think its true. Theres been a history of Wandy being accused of using while in Pride. Shogun and him were/are very close and its not crazy to believe that if one was using so was the other. he's a completely different fighter. he was known for having legendary cardio. he was an aggressive beast in Pride. he doesnt even look like a shell of his former self. he looks like an entirely different guy in build and in his fighting style. i like Shogun and hope he's not juicing and comes back looking great. I think he's going to get Knocked out by Chuck then i think Rampage could get a shot at him and send him out of the UFC. pending on where Page is at in his career.
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  9. ProFane

    ProFane dB's Finest

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    True about the soccer kicks and Pride being a better fit for him. i do agree with that 100 percent. had this been Pride we may be having a completely different convo. Something is off thats for sure and he better fix it soon because his paycheck is to big to sort it out in the cage.
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