How can Chronic 2001 be considered classic

Discussion in 'Hip-Hop Central' started by Twamp, Jul 7, 2013.

  1. thedream233

    thedream233 Thrillmatic

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    well, in the 80s I didnt even know what hip hop was... hell I didnt even get into rap until 95...

    in fact...

    Big Daddy Kane is one of those rappers that caught my attention when I got my 160gb Ipod in 2008 and started downloading every rapper known to man and just listening to hours upon hours of hip hop I never heard before. I think I really grew as far as my taste in hip hop after that period.

    thats when Louis Logic and demigodz started to disappear from my top 10 lists lol
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  2. NinjaMic

    NinjaMic Brian Disease

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    Infamous by itself is a million times better than all his albums put together, though.

    Anybody can do what Kanye does... just write like you're in elementary school, use only plain English (ie: prose instead of poetry or even purple prose), completely ignore the concept of technique either to be understandable to the lowest common denominator of the middle class bible belt or out of an inability to keep up, spit with a drawl, and rap about yourself in a flattering way and try to be clever doing it. Occasionally drop a "gem" that a real knowledgeable cat would consider a common pebble on a gravel road, and make dumb people think you're a worldly genius shedding light on the issues.

    Use recognizable samples that the greater American conscious finds enjoyable, don't alter them much, get them paid for, get guest appearances, write 16 bars, do a hook that matches what you're saying. Tribe can do it. De La can do it. Arrested Development can do it. Wyclef can do it. Outkast can do it. Goodie Mob can do it. Lil Wayne can do it. Britney Spears can do it. Justin Timberlake can do it. Phil Collins can do it. Elvis could do it. Puffy can do it. Kanye is basically Puff Daddy without a ghost writer.

    You gotta dead that "NY rap in the 90's is never unique" logic... it doesn't hold water. P doesn't sound like anybody. Havoc's sound is still unmistakable, despite all his progeny. They all have their own dialect, slang, techniques, and personalities. Average joes talking about smoking weed, having feelings, going to summer camp to learn about Jesus, shopping at the mall and working a hot dog stand to get by aren't more unique and creative than people who spit, think and act like products of a very distinct culture from within a rich, diverse, and well populated city that is more unique than 99% of the rest of the US by virtue of it's constant melting pot that hasn't stopped stirring since people started coming off the boats and going up north.
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  3. Mel Man

    Mel Man Wat ya'll bout to witness

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    Mobb got a huge discography too, 7 albums, 13 year career, couple classics, handful of dope albums

    most importantly P has 6, 7 solo albums out now, 1 of which just came out

    You need to learn to seperate emcees from groups, how come you can do it with wu tang but can't do it with Mobb deep? We talkin P not Mobb deep here, they are not Siamese my nigga.

    P has a solo career, why you only bringing up Mobb deep,do you not respect P as a solo artist?

    to me P always stood out n does to this day, sorry that you can't see this..mobb deep has too..

    Every verse he spit on INfamous was fire, not 1 wack or mediocre verse on a whole album, I keep tellin niggaz

    again you talking out of ignorance n bias
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  4. Mel Man

    Mel Man Wat ya'll bout to witness

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    I think 2001 can be considered modern day classic

    forsure
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  5. Im Technical

    Im Technical I got 30 pages of rhymes

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    Thats the truth right there. Touch the sky, diamonds are forever and gold digger really helped him blow up in the commercial market and they are some of the most easily recognisable samples you'll ever hear. Alot of his samples are barely cut up even on his lesser known records, not to say he doesnt have alot of really good beats but hes over rated as a producer.

    Mobb Deep are leagues ahead of kanye as hip hop artists, the infamous and hell on earth>kanye best 2 albums. Prodigy and Havoc both put out solo albums recently that shit all over anything kanyes done in a long time. There really are alot of rappers who not only have better catalogues but are better artists than kanye west.
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  6. THEDONN

    THEDONN One Love

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    prodigy>kanye
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  7. Ignorant

    Ignorant Village Idiot

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    Agreed.

    When people talk about "hipster" hip hop... I think of cats like Tribe, Digable Planets and De La from the '90s... but I guess "hipster" has changed... I was into that kind of "hipster" back then, but not nowadays.
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  8. Halfway_Crook

    Halfway_Crook Well-Known Member

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    Excellent post.

    And it's true; people all too often just lump all '90s NY hip hop in the same basket. However the ones who released timeless classics from this period are held in such high regard because they all have their own styles.

    Prodigy has one of the best mic presences I've heard in rap, as well as a flawless flow and his own conversational way of rapping with rhyme schemes that have no set structure and always switch up.

    Havoc's dope in his own right as he's always got that energy, even if he's fairly basic as far as technique goes.
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  9. Freebass

    Freebass NAH NUDDAH

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    I agree with the first part, and I think shit like gold digger might have been what made him ultra successful commercially......The beat is creatively done when you look at it as a song and completed concept....It is not as though that sample was such an obvious flipping op, and it was not like Georgia on my mind popular before ye sampled it....Touch the sky was made by just blaze, and that beat is exceptionally well made even though the sample is a well known one....that doesn't take away from the finished product quality......And diamonds are forever was a pretty damn good Idea for him to use given the roc-a-fella situation and working with jay.....also the beat has some kind of bass line that is intricate enough if ye added it.....I don't think a sample has to be some hidden gen for it to be used and def doesn't if it is used well.....

    H to the IZZO is still an amazing flip on one of the most flipped samples
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  10. Freebass

    Freebass NAH NUDDAH

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    Rap wise he hasn't done the most ground breaking shit at all, and I don't think dude is a great rapper by any means.....his production style came on at the right time, and he carved a nice place for himself to do what he really wants and he gets a pass for a lot of not special beats because of the spot he has......he proved his talent with sound in my eyes, he went in a direction that surprised me and made me question him too......I hate that I have just come off like a kanye defender when I do not much enjoy dude, but I understand his success is not something that anyone could do.....If that were the case there would be a million kanye wests running around france in spandex.....But I have become sick of sounding like I'm defending dude.....he has made some good stuff

    signing off
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  11. Vulgar

    Vulgar 80s baby

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    Awww man I gotta catch up is the thread still on topic?

    Cigar Life on Tapatalk 2
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  12. Mel Man

    Mel Man Wat ya'll bout to witness

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    Yup, again a kid from the burbs cannot properly overstand the streets and the rappers it breeds...especially NY maybe the grimiest hip hop city of all time..they attempt to throw them all in a box as if this is some how true and holds weight, those who know better know it don't..

    All NY rappers, or those at the cream of the crop, which was many, stood out, n do today too...whether you like em or not is one thing, but you gotta give credit where it's due

    After Raekwon's debut some NY rappers began emulating the poppin formula..n there's been plenty NY rappers acusin other locals of bitin due to the rule of originality..

    - Shark Niggas
    -Big/Nas album cover
    - P accused BIG of runnin with "Notorious" after "Infamous" came out
    - P accused Jay of bitin his n Nas style claimin he neva used to shoot his videos in the hood or rappin like he was 96 n on..until Mobb Deep n Nas started too..

    These Niggaz would get a D in History man..
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  13. Freebass

    Freebass NAH NUDDAH

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    what NY rappers deserve credit that don't get credit?...
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  14. Mel Man

    Mel Man Wat ya'll bout to witness

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    Have a convo with Dream n you'll hear plenty..

    he just shit on mobb deep in here on some fake fan shit
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  15. Mel Man

    Mel Man Wat ya'll bout to witness

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    Dream wasn't there listenin to The Infamous in 95 when it dropped n seein jus how much Mobb stood out then n continued to their whole career he prob caught on to them in the 00's when 8 Mile dropped hence the ignorance..

    if you not followin a movie from the start n start watchin mid way or even later and then don't take the time to re watch the whole movie after how you gonna appreciate it??
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  16. Mel Man

    Mel Man Wat ya'll bout to witness

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    Idiot

    This is credit where it's due Free?
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  17. Freebass

    Freebass NAH NUDDAH

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    I have read dream talk about the stuff, but I was asking you....But I just was curious of which rappers you meant.....mobb deep gets a lot of credit, and they are well into the history books.......what more credit do they deserve beyond opinion
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  18. Freebass

    Freebass NAH NUDDAH

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    Not everyone is going to give the same praise as the next....and credit is faaar different than taste/opinion
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  19. NinjaMic

    NinjaMic Brian Disease

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    I feel you. I'm sick of sounding like I hate the dude's guts to make the point that hip-hop outside of the last 5 years, full of slang, underbelly of the beast thought & philosophy, sick styles, crazy beats and flow that focuses on technique isn't all average bullshit to people who like music more than they like rap, and pretty much only like soft, safe work-friendly white people music, or stuff that's only "edgy" and "hardcore" in a cartoonish and gimmicky way.

    I don't agree that there would be a million... people don't want to hear a million. There can almost always be "only one" of any given style in music, at any given time. The media consuming public at large thinks of entertainment in terms of "rip offs" - that's about the only standing integrity they have, though they're not often informed enough to know that what they think is a genuine originator, is really an amalgamation of influences that predate the moment they shifted the all seeing-eye onto the new thing. ie: "Eminem rip off" being such a common phrase applied to complexity and technique outside of the learned hip-hop community.

    They want to see the Colonol at Kentucky Fried Chicken, not Samuel Jackson. They want to see Charlie Sheen on Two and a Half Men, not Ashton Kutcher. Accept no substitutes. On top of that, extremely talented people who can be that, don't necessarily want to be that and if they do/can there's no room for them. That seat's taken.
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  20. NinjaMic

    NinjaMic Brian Disease

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    There can be progeny and a whole subgenre that comes from a person who popularizes a style. Lil Wayne was able to come into the game and eat everyone's lunch when simple, witty bars and southern inflection was popularized finally. That's what a lot of the new blood is now, but who are they to the world?

    Like when Pearl Jam and Nirvana were around in the early 90's, there was a whole "grunge rock" scene. All kinds of 20-30 year olds watching MTV had flannel shirts, torn jeans, boots and there was a million Kurt Cobains and whatever his wife's name was... thousands of bands and one-hit wonders. Who were all these bands? No one knows. Nobody outside of the really focused following of the scene had a clue about any of it.

    The same age group knew what Wu-Tang was, but maybe only knew who Method Man and ODB were, if that. I remember album reviews giving props to Cuban Linx, and then calling Liquid Swords a letdown, because GZA's "gimmicky lyrics" were a waste of RZA's incredible production. In the same article, Chronic was Rolling Stone's #2 album of the 90's behind one of Nirvana's... Doggystyle and All Eyez On Me were getting down into the teens and twenties... Dogg Pound wasn't even on the 90 album list. Miseducation of Lauryn Hill was in the top 5 iirc. Erykah Badu was nowhere. Nate Dogg's solos didn't even exist. The Score was down in the 20's mixed in with random music from other genres.

    The average person only has time for one or two things of a kind, and that's the audience where Kanye's world domination is had. There can be a million overqualified applicants and only a couple of open positions. You also need the marketing machine behind you to be at that level... there's only a few machines, and they can't spread themselves too thin if they want to throw all their weight behind a super mega star that keeps the whole label in employed.
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