For those that accuse Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) of being a pedophile

Discussion in 'IntroSpectrum' started by Thrilla-Ali, Apr 19, 2008.

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  1. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    To answer your first question, the age of consent is based upon the society itself, and the governments of Spain, Italy, Japan, and France are all democratic. Governments of developed nations are often a reflection of their own people, therefore the majority of the people living in these countries agree with the age of consent, otherwise the laws would have changed. Not everyone agree's that 16 is a good age for consensual sex either, yet it's part of the law in America. Some countries have 18yrs or older, so should americans be considered pedophiles??

    And what makes you think Muhammad (pbuh) was 'taking advantage' of aisha? In order to be taken advantage of, there at least has to be some reasonable grounds in order to make that claim. She was proud to have been wedded to the prophet of islam. Pedophilia is a mental disorder where a man is attracted to prepubescent males or females, and only them. The prophet had a wife older than him, and the other wives being much older than Aisha. Therefore, the title itself does not apply to him, use some logic here. There's a difference between pedophiles and predators, and one characteristic about them is that they have very low self-esteem and confidence, and they're intimidated by women their age (the prophet had high morale). The prophet was not a predator either, because predators prey and also abuse young people, whereas the prophets betrothment with aisha was actually suggested to him by someone else, and later on he had a prophecy by god that he should marry her (aisha is a very important figure in islam because she was responsible for a good portion of hadith that exists today, she is known as the mother of believers).

    As for your other comments, where are they coming from? So islam means "war" to you? No wonder your posts come across in such an angrily tone and manner. You don't like islam in the first place, so are you here for understanding or are you posting for war? You sound so beliigerent. As for turning this argument against the white man, have no idea what you're talking about lol

    And as for puberty itself, as soon as menstration begins a significant metamorphosis takes place biologically, especially based on the environment your living in (climate and society). The acheivements and responsibilities of young men and women throughout various era's (and even today) is something which you don't seem interested in grasping, but that's if you ask me.
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  2. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    "Children today" are defined by their social norms, the same goes for the rest of the world for that matter. How hard is it to grasp that people who live elsewhere may not agree with your 'standards?'

    A 16 year old is "almost" fully developed so therefore it wouldn't be considered "pedophilia" by you lol JOKE. Little do you know how biased you sound, and how you're going against your own individual based principles. Did you know that the age of consent in most countries in the world is 14? And can even go as low as 12 depending on parental consent? And im referring 1st world countries here. Learn epike (sp?)

    And what does the doctrine of islam have to do with the actions of bad apples within the community?
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  3. Degenerate One

    Degenerate One Noe Nose Touching

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    Your argument...is ridiculous. It has nothing to do with "my bias"...or my own principles....Im going by the Definition OF A CHILD, and the definition of pedophilia

    Child - someone who is between birth and puberty

    Child - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    A teenager is obviously different.

    The age of consent, doesnt mean an adult, can legally fuck an teenager. There's usually a 5 year age limit....google it. The age of consent refers to consenting teenagers having sex, without it being illegal.


    "Pedophilia (or paedophilia) is a psychological disorder in which an adult or older adolescent experiences a sexual preference for prepubescent children"

    Your statement
    is wrong, obviously youve been misinformed, or didnt understand fully. Where in the definition of pedophilia does it say ONLY MEN, and ATTRACTION ONLY TO CHILDREN?

    It doesnt....fact is, alot of pedophiles are attracted to all types of woman.

    Also


    You've obviously never looked into the victims. Also, you didnt fully read my last post.

    Alot of victims of pedophilia....Dont understand that anything bad is happening...Some, even like it...or engage the adult. Dont think it feels good to them? ANY stimulation to the genitals "feels good" no matter what age.


    Also, no shit she would be "proud" to have married a "prophet" of Islam. Again, you didnt even read my statement addressing that issue


    Of course if this girl grew up IDOLIZING and looking up to a "prophet" she woulod have no objection to marriage...she would be for it...
    Pedophilia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    So, a teenager can also be a pedophile.

    Attraction to teenagers IS NOT pedophilia...they arent children, as I said...physically, they are closer to an adult.

    "Ephebophilia, is the adult sexual preference for mid-to-late adolescents, generally ages 15 to 19"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ephebophilia

    if a 9 year old, has the body of a child..and you are attracted to her, YOU ARE A PEDOPHILE.

    It doesnt matter what her "mental maturity" level is...she has the body of a child....prepubescent....



    Now, I DO recognize in other countries they find excuses to make sex with children acceptable by deeming them "mentally mature"

    But if we go by definitions, your whole argument sir and attempt at justification,is wrong.


    Also, there are bad apples in every group, religion, subculture etc...but the fundamentals of Islam, have an underlying HATE of Jews.
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  4. x - calli

    x - calli friend of israel

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    you stated that pedophilia is a sexual preference for children. given that muhammad had been with other women, including women older than him, shows that he did not have a sexual preference for children and was not a pedophile. also, its entirely possible that aisha had already physically entered puberty by the age of 9.

    also, considering that islam accepts and respects "peoples of the book" including christians and jews, how could there be any underlying hatred of jews in the fundamentals of islam?
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  5. Degenerate One

    Degenerate One Noe Nose Touching

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    Wow, you totally disregarded statements within my post.....

    To qualify as a pedophile...you DONT need to be exclusively attracted to children. Many pedo's are married.

    Also, entering puberty...is still a stage attributed to children. You can try to word things however you want to justify Muham's actions. But if he had ANY attraction to a child, he qualifies as a pedophile.



    There are contradictory statements within the qua ran. It says treat Jews with respect, yet...they label them (and everyone else) as infidels...and according to the qua ran...what are you supposed to do with infidels?
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  6. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    Actually, the age of consent in Canada and the United states is 16. And yes, in both the united states and canada a 16 year old can marry a 32 year old (a 16 year old can get married with parental consent, and depending on the courts, without parental consent). In Canada, the age of consent use to be 14 fyi. Many African nations have the age of consent set to 18 years of age, while many european nations have it set to 14, and of course Canada and the United states it's set to 16 (most states). What if someone were to attack your nations age of consent laws because it's set to 16? And because of that, they believe your nation is immoral and wrong? You said it yourself, Now, I DO recognize in other countries they find excuses to make sex with children acceptable by deeming them "mentally mature" And i ask what age would the age of consent be in 'those countries?', 13, or 14 perhaps (like most of europe?).

    Pedophiles are attracted to prebubescent men and women. Now Predators on the other hand, seek to take advantage of or harm young pubescent men and women. That's why they call it 'to catch a predator', and not a pedophile. And i know a pedophile can be a woman too but the gender in context here are males. I already posted what the clinical definition of what pedophilia was already when i created the thread.

    I did fully read your post and i also addressed this in my previous post. To elaborate, for one, her parents consent was also given, her parents were grown adults who made this decision as well (not only her). Secondly, she was a pubescent woman that made a concious decision. There are no grounds to say she was 'preyed' upon because of her age, because there's no quarrels here besides your own cultural bias. She wasn't ready for marriage according to you, but not according to her and her society - its subjective.
    And it's obvious you don't know what the definition of pedophile is because the term 'pedophile' is coined for individuals who are only attracted to prepubescent children and are also intimidated by people of their own age group. So two things to remember in order to label a person a pedophile (1) attraction to prepubescent males or females (2) intimidation and no desire for someone in their own age group. Pedophiles have an obsession with prepubescent males and females. So no, my prophet is not a pedophile.




    Like a bad free throw shot - you missed the point. You said attraction to teenagers is not pedophilia, which i agree to. However, my point was this: how would you like it if someone from elsewhere started demoralizing the united states for having the age of consent set to 16? Whilst in their country it's 18. And they made a mockery out of it. Like i said, most places in europe have it set to 14 and in spain it's 13 - a few years apart from 16. As i've been stating all along here, 'wrong' and 'right' is subject to the culture/norm. Ephebophilia is accepted in most countries in the world (and it's not considered to be a mental disorder), of course in some states and countries there are details involved like whether the person is a guardian or tutor of the child, for example. With that said, in Canada and the United states he/she can get married to a 45 year old at the age of 16.

    As for having the body of a prepubescent child, many teenagers don't devolope breasts that early either, or barely have any pubic hair for that matter. However, it is said that climatic conditions can speed up the process of puberty, which could give reason why 9 year olds were bearing children in the middle east and other places in the world, and also the 9 year old can possibly be even more developed than a teenager of today (i seen examples where younger women were more developed both mentally and physically than older woman).

    Your arguments really don't carry much weight because it's only an opinion. Whilst the opinions of others are different, you simply can accept the differences of other cultures when it comes to age of consent or not, but arguing about it won't change the facts. Just because it's wrong to you, doesn't mean they agree. "They" being the Japanese, Spaniards, indeginous tribes (etc) - any other applicable nation or civilization.

    And there's no underlying hate for Jews in Islam, you can read up on all the anti-islamic web pages there are (via google search engine) but you still won't find the truth unless you speak with muslims. Prove your claims by referring me to verse numbers.
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  7. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    First off, just because your married doesn't mean your attracted to your wife neccessarily. Marriage can be a social pressure in order to satisfy family (parents, aunts/uncles) and also to pull a front for whatever reason. Pedophiles have a sexual preference for prepubescents. They find children to be non-threatening while finding adults to be the opposite. And on top of that, they're either primarily or exclusively attracted to prepubescents. Muhammad does not qualify as a pedophile, because there's many characteristics of pedophilia which he does not fall under,

    Also, you stated how Aisha was supposedly taken advantage of. Wouldn't she despise him after she got older? (which happens quite often than not in our society today. Victims of pedophilia become enraged when they get older).

    This scenario isn't befitting for the prophet either because he never was a pedophile in the first place. Aisha was 18 when he died, and he died on her lap. She had a lot of respect for the prophet, and no anger.
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  8. Degenerate One

    Degenerate One Noe Nose Touching

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    I dont have time to read that wall of text because im in the middle moving...but ill scan through and make a few points.


    Ok, Muham possibly wasnt attracted to his wife. Did they have sex? why would you have sex with someone your not attracted to?

    I never stated Aisha would begrudge him...it was acceptable. There were no social conditions labeling it "bad" so she would not of grown up to hate him.

    Your really intent on making people not seem like pedo's haa

    SO, because there were no laws against pedophilia, lets say 200 years ago...does that mean there werent pedophiles?

    We need words to describe things/actions. Pedophilia has been going on for years, even though it was once accepted, it still doesnt change the definition of what it is..

    attraction to children.
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  9. Imperial1

    Imperial1 For pressed ones only

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    Absolutely nothing. He's one of those anti islam idiots with his head up his anus.

    Imperial1
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  10. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    None of his marriages were based on lust/attraction. They were based on political gain, and the 'gain' here was peace and brotherhood amongst different tribes (etc). His marriage to Aisha was god given and came as a suggestion to him by someone else. Predators and pedophiles alike prefer prepubescent and/or young pubescent people. If the prophet were to fit this mould, he would've only married 9 year olds, but instead, his first wife was twice his age and following from there he married Sawda bint Zama who was also older than him (it was also suggested to marry her). And with pedophilia there comes intent, and pedophiles know that they're breaking the law and what they're doing is wrong because of their misconduct with prepubescent people. Intent also comes into play in the judicial system and for good reason too. Your only reinforcing my argument when you say things like "There were no social conditions labeling it "bad" so she would not of grown up to hate him". And it wasn't pedophilia because of the aformetioned ^
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  11. Brown_Menace

    Brown_Menace Honey Hitta

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    i don't think he was a pedophile cuz pedophiles have personas which are different from the likes of mohammad clearly you'd know that if you ever read the koran from front to back
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  12. RapCritik

    RapCritik New Member

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    Ah.

    But do you know any of these multitudes of 9-year-olds who are just as much an adult as you are?

    Do you know any of them? Or are you just theorizing.

    "Mohamed's 9-year-old was an adult. He's not a pedophile"

    Can't argue with that reasoning.
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  13. RapCritik

    RapCritik New Member

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    How can you say I'm the one who's arguing out of prejudice? That I'm the one who's got his mind made up and closed to facts?

    YOU'RE THE ONE WHO IS CLOSING THEIR MIND TO FACTS. YOU are the one who's prejudiced.

    Because I know that no matter what I say, you'll stand by your prophet, defending his moral right to fuck 9-year-olds (even if his "moral right" was particular to a time and place).

    ...As for Christianity being a tool of governance....The Catholic Church, The Pope, all of that - that shit does not follow the teachings of Jesus. They used Jesus' teachings as a means to power. They are not the true religion. The true religion of Jesus is of the heart. Jesus never taught about how a society should be run or governed - unlike Islam. Islam is a legalistic doctrine. Besides wiping your ass, they tell you with which hand to eat...and go right up to how to do business, how to run the economy. Islam is a culture.

    Go to Malaysia and see how the muslims there live. Their own cultural customs have been lost since they were converted, and now their culture is basically Arab, with few reminders of their past.

    "She was a mature 9-year-old and it was an accepted practice!" ..... smh

    whatever
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  14. RapCritik

    RapCritik New Member

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    Cuz he talked about God?

    Psychos who do crazy shit more often than not talk about God and have some sort of deep religious conviction.

    Imagine a gang of people riding into your town on horseback. They put a sword to yours and everybody else's throat and say you either adopt their religion or they'll cut your head off. Would you defend such people?

    That's how muslims spread Islam back then.

    Marrying and fucking 9-year-old's is not a stretch or a bad thing for them. <---- And that's the point Thrilla is trying to make, after all.
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  15. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    A prejudice person prejudges matters, and on many occasion you have prejudged islam, and continue to do so. You don't know the religion in its entirety nor do you understand the theology. All you have are google articles as your 'aresenal' to launch your discriminative attacks on islam.


    And no matter how many times i refute your baseless attacks, you'll continue to be anti-islamic.

    FYI jesus did teach how a society should be governed, just read his famous speech on mount zion. He did reinforce the 10 commandments which are laws that society should obey and obide by at all times. The mosaic laws are not only part of Judaic theology but Christian theology as well because both the new and old testaments make the holy bible. Mosaic laws of the OT are a lot like the shariah laws of the qu'ran, and since jesus is 'god' to christians, it was god himself who instated the mosaic laws by using Moses (pbuh) as his mouth peice. Therefore you have no right to patrionize muslims and attack their religion as being too 'strict' or dehumanizing because you would clearly would be a hypocrite in doing so. Like or not, the mosaic law is part of christianity, whether its fully or partially applied today or not.

    FYI malaysia is not an "arab" society, they're still very much oriental and a good porportion of their country is non-muslim. Just because your religion is islam doesn't mean your culture is arab stupid lol
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  16. Imperial1

    Imperial1 For pressed ones only

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    No, it still exists today. Look it up under "child marriages." You'll find pics of young girls and boys being married. The youngest person to have a baby was 5yrs old. It's in the world records.

    Imperial1
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  17. RapCritik

    RapCritik New Member

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    A muslim in Alaska...what's his holy language? Arabic. A muslim in Finland, where's his holy land? Saudi Arabia.

    As a matter of duty, new muslims are to learn Arabic so they can read the Koran in God's holy language. Common practices which were in place to deal with the desert conditions of Saudi Arabia, a muslim in Russia has to adopt (like washing your hands and feet before you pray, like women covering their heads, like those long sheets that the men wear to let everyone know that they're holy)

    Islam is a culture just as much as it is a religion. It can not be practiced in its intended form in a pluralistic society. (How can it? Despite what muslims like you proclaim, I've read with my own eyes how your book says to kill unbelievers. I've also read how it says the Jews and the Christians have strayed and must meet the wrath of Allah.)

    Christianity, on the other hand, can be practiced in a pluralistic society.

    That's the main reason why Christianity wasn't spread by the sword and Islam was. (And don't talk about the Crusades. That was a war over territory, not a war of proselytizing)
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  18. RapCritik

    RapCritik New Member

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    I didn't ask you if any 9-year-olds are getting married today. I asked you if you knew any 9-year-olds who had an "adult consciousness" as mature as your own. That was your argument, "If they are smart and have an adult consciousness, I don't see a problem with them marrying and fucking" ... that's what you said, in so many words.

    Just because adults got together and decided this 9-year-old should marry this other 9-year-old doesn't mean they are mature *and acceptable under the conditions of your argument*.

    Try again.
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  19. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    You really don't have the right idea of islam, your views are warped and i don't know how it came to be like that but your certainly wrong. Don't ever try to understand any holy book of a religion without proper instruction, believe me when i tell you that, you won't be able to understand the meanings of certain verses without a guide to help you.

    Islam was not spread through forced conversions. I think you read too many anti-islamic websites or something maybe you could fill me in on that one.

    Of course, in islam you have to do something called wudu before you pray, which is ablution. Muslims memorize arabic verses from the quran and read arabic, however, muslims who aren't from the middle east can't speak arabic (they only know verses from the quran). I for one cannot speak arabic and my countrymen are far off from having an arabic culture. Arabs have a great culture, very classy believe it or not. But muslims from elsewhere don't have the same culture as them, just the same religion. Although religion ties in to culture to some extent, it doesn't represent the culture in its full extent.
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  20. Imperial1

    Imperial1 For pressed ones only

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    Actually, I know 3 and 4yr olds who walk, think, and talk like teenagers and 7, 8 and 9yr olds who walk, think, talk and act like grown-ups because they're in a single parent home. My sister was one of em. How bout YOU try again.

    Imperial1
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