Do Economists Understand the Economy?

Discussion in 'IntroSpectrum' started by Mcg-, Apr 5, 2009.

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  1. Volaticus

    Volaticus Anarcho-Capitalist

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    Man can NEVER reach some idyllic post-scarcity stage of existence because his TIME will always be a scarce resource.
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  2. Radium

    Radium f k

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  3. Radium

    Radium f k

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    no you never once brought up anything related to scarcity. you were trying to say how assumptions on the human nature were impossible and spent the whole thread arguing behind that failure of a point.

    I'm sorry but you're mad gay for arguing in that style. There was nothing constructive in the things you were saying at all. by the way you're presence is basically useless anyway since you abandoned your main point and you're now hiding behind Volaticus' point

    but you dont need to leave. it would be a nice change of pace though if you could add something actually constructive to things
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  4. Volaticus

    Volaticus Anarcho-Capitalist

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    The same way any resource is scarce, it exists only in limited supply. Each unit of time; Hour, day, week, month, year, is a fraction of the total available time to each of us. Time is a scarce resource. If our time was not scarce, it would have no value, and could command no price on the market.
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  5. Radium

    Radium f k

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    uh you seem to be arguing mortality. that is, that each of us have a limited life-span. is this what you really mean?

    because for all purposes theres no reason why technology couldn't find a way to prolong life-spans considering its been doing that steadily over the last 1500 years or so anyway
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  6. Volaticus

    Volaticus Anarcho-Capitalist

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    Sure, we've managed to substantially extend our lifetimes, but eventually you're going to see diminishing returns. We will not be immortal. But then, even if we did at some point achieve immortality, and could live forever, our time would still be a scarce resource due to various time preferences (preferring to achieve a certain end sooner vs. later.) Post scarcity is a pipe dream.
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  7. Mcg-

    Mcg- New Member

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    more bullshit.
    pls quote where i said "assumptions on the human nature were impossible." i love this character your constructing of me. hilarious. You've created McGirthism.

    stick to what i actually write from now to know what my arguments are.
    i've pretty much stuck to 2 points the whole time, which according to the character you created of me, you got past.

    the 2 points:
    1-you assessment of human motives is subjective (Von Meses Point) and likely wrong or at least not surely right in many instances.
    2-even if it wasn't, you need to map it out so it forms an economic system (which is the point Vol's critique of post 10 addresses - basically, that the implications you map out are absurb)
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  8. Radium

    Radium f k

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    well then suppose we do achieve immortality (and thus by implication, freedom from physical dangers)

    we would have all the time we could ask for. only that, as you've said, you could only do one thing at a time. but I dont see why this would impede freedom from scarcity

    imagine this

    you are immortal and healthy as a lark

    you spend you're days playing tennis, reading books and spending time with your immortal girlfriend. you eat whatever you want as the problem of food has been removed (you're immortal and thus can't starve to death). you sleep when you want and wake up as you please, repeating your days endlessly bouncing from one form of recreation to the next.

    I've not yet encountered the problem of time scarcity

    please show where in this example that the problem of time scarcity can occur
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  9. Radium

    Radium f k

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    sigh

    I did get past your points. thats why I'm talking to Volaticus and not you (remember you abandoned point 1 and then after 2 pages of me having to prove something completely obvious for most regular people to you out of nowhere you switched up and pointed your finger at Volaticus' post on all the way back on page 1 and asked me to argue with that which i am currently doing)
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  10. Volaticus

    Volaticus Anarcho-Capitalist

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  11. Mcg-

    Mcg- New Member

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    oh look more narrative. i thought you stopped arguing because you were too busy writing about mcgirthism
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  12. Volaticus

    Volaticus Anarcho-Capitalist

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    By immortality, I'm talking about simply living for a greatly extended (or even practically infinite) period of time, so long as you maintain. You still would have to eat, drink, sleep, etc. Heinlein suggested in Time Enough For Love (and its predecessor Methuselah's Children) that this would be done with "rejuvenators" in the future (Lazarus Long being the oldest living human, at well over 1,000 years old.)

    But like I said, even drastically extended lifetimes will not bring about post scarcity, because time resources will still be limited (even if more abundant.) There will still be only a certain limited amount that can be done during waking hours, and some of those things will take priority over others (more urgent wants take precedence over less urgent wants, as determined by an individual's subjective time preference.)
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  13. Radium

    Radium f k

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    youre sounding like a woman right now
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  14. Radium

    Radium f k

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    youre right.

    but how does only being able to do one thing at a time actually invalidate anything. that is, what is the negative effect of this on the labor-less society that would cause this society to actually not exist?
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  15. Volaticus

    Volaticus Anarcho-Capitalist

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    I think you're begging the question here.
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  16. Radium

    Radium f k

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    can you expand that point
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  17. Volaticus

    Volaticus Anarcho-Capitalist

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    My point is that you seem to be asserting (without substantiation) the idea that automation will lead to a post-scarcity society where labor is unnecessary and all resources, including our own time, will be super-abundant, and demand will never outpace supply.

    Begging the question.
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  18. Radium

    Radium f k

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    you would mainly need two types of technology

    technology that can think and technology that can manipulate reality at the molecular or even atomic level

    whens the last time you talked to ghetalion? has it been that long?
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  19. Volaticus

    Volaticus Anarcho-Capitalist

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    Less than a week actually. He seems to have largely come around to my line of thinking.
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  20. Radium

    Radium f k

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    he never talked to you about singularity technology and the like?
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