discussion thread

Discussion in 'The Sanctuary' started by TheBigPayback, Dec 31, 2012.

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  1. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    I thought u said we had to live by the whole law. unless uve revised ur understanding to the commandments. cus before u were saying the entire law. @Coup d'etat
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  2. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    @TheBigPayback

    Faith in Yahshua is to believe in him and follow him. Yes, we are to strive with all our mind, heart and power to obey the perfect law of Yahuwah, as the King taught.

    There is one path to the Father and it starts with Yahshua. His sacrifice redeemed us and done away with the judgments of the law, not the law itself.

    Shalom my brother in Mesiah.
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  3. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Ya but ur not being specific enough here.
    Do we need to live by the law meaning the laws and rules
    for the hebrew people under self governance throughout
    the 5 books. OR are u saying now that we must live by the comandments
    of the the law.
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  4. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    And dont get me wrong im not trying to sweat u im just looking to see
    where ur coming from nowadays.
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  5. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    @Coup d'etat
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  6. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    Good question


    Exodus 12:49
    One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

    Some can't be kept though...you will have to ask questions, I would be happy to talk about it. No, we do not sacrifice animals for a number of reasons.

    Is John specific enough ?

    I John 5:3
    For this is the love of Elohim, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

    Let me know if you want me to be specific on anything but you have ask a clear, well thought out question first :p
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  7. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Right. if ur agreeing that yes the commandments are to be kept but apart from the commandments
    The laws regaurding the self governance of the hebrew people were exactly that. than i believe we are finally in agreement here.
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  8. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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  9. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    i edited so take a look
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  10. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    Just to clarify, tell me what are the laws regarding the 'self governance of the Hebrew's' and how are they different from the rest of us ?

    I'm not sure I understand you on this.
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  11. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Simply put -we (believers)are to live according to the 10 commandments.

    aside from those. the righteous, (believers) are not subject to the entirety of laws of the 5 books.
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  12. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    @TheBigPayback I say this out of love.

    That is so very wrong my friend. I would be lying to you if I did not tell you that. Tell me where does the scriptures teach that ? That is evil. That doctrine is not taught in the scriptures. Who taught you that ? If you are truly living by the ten commandments you know not to take Yah's name in vain or worship other gods.

    Exodus 20:3, 7
    Thou shalt have no other gods before me

    Thou shalt not take the name of Yahuwah thy Elohim in vain; for Yah will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.


    Not obeying every word that comes out of the Fathers mouth is to take him in vain. Like celebrating Christmas. That is to put another god before you. The Torah (first five books) is for all mankind. Not just the Hebrews. Hebrews were soposed to be a priest nation unto Yah and teach the world about him.

    Leviticus 23:15-16,21


    And ye shall count unto you from the MORROW AFTER THE SABBATH, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete: Even unto the MORROW AFTER the SEVENTH SABBATH shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto Yahuwah...And ye shall proclaim on the selfsame day, that it may be an holy convocation unto you: ye shall do no servile work therein: it shall be a statue FOR EVER in ALL your dwellings throughout your generations

    The High day's, the weekly Sabbath and all that are forever. We must observe them to our best abilities.

    Leviticus 23:1-4

    And the Lord spake unto Moses saying, Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of Yahuwah, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are MY feasts.

    When we don't keep the perfect law of the Father the world is torn up

    Isaiah 24:4-6
    The earth mourneth and fadeth away, the world languisheth and fadeth away, the haughty people of the earth do languish. The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof; because they have TRANSGRESSED THE LAWS, CHANGED THE ORDINANCES, BROKEN THE EVERLASTING COVENANT.

    Which ones are you following ? The Commandments of Yahuwah? Or the commandments and the traditions of men?

    Even when the Kingdom comes we will still observe them. Doing so now on earth is rehersing for this. Practice.

    Isaiah 66:22-23

    For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith Yahuwah, so shall your seed and your name remain. And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith Yahuwah.

    //

    My question to you is: Why can we be perfect in keeping all the man made holy days like Christmas, Ester, New Year's and scoff at keeping the Creators appointed days to be observed forever ? And pretend they don't apply ? Up is down, down is up. Crazy.

    And to say nothing about what Yahshua said.
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  13. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    That is so very wrong my friend. I would be lying to you if I did not tell you that. Tell me where does the scriptures teach that ? That is evil. That doctrine is not taught in the scriptures. Who taught you that ? If you are truly living by the ten commandments you know not to take Yah's name in vain or worship other gods.

    Exodus 20:3, 7
    Thou shalt have no other gods before me

    Thou shalt not take the name of Yahuwah thy Elohim in vain; for Yah will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.


    Not obeying every word that comes out of the Fathers mouth is to take him in vain. Like celebrating Christmas. That is to put another god before you. The Torah (first five books) is for all mankind. Not just the Hebrews. Hebrews were soposed to be a priest nation unto Yah and teach the world about him.

    Leviticus 23:15-16,21

    And ye shall count unto you from the MORROW AFTER THE SABBATH, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete: Even unto the MORROW AFTER the SEVENTH SABBATH shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto Yahuwah...And ye shall proclaim on the selfsame day, that it may be an holy convocation unto you: ye shall do no servile work therein: it shall be a statue FOR EVER in ALL your dwellings throughout your generations

    The High day's, the weekly Sabbath and all that are forever. We must observe them to our best abilities.

    Leviticus 23:1-4

    And the Lord spake unto Moses saying, Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of Yahuwah, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are MY feasts.

    When we don't keep the perfect law of the Father the world is torn up

    Isaiah 24:4-6
    The earth mourneth and fadeth away, the world languisheth and fadeth away, the haughty people of the earth do languish. The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof; because they have TRANSGRESSED THE LAWS, CHANGED THE ORDINANCES, BROKEN THE EVERLASTING COVENANT.

    Which ones are you following ? The Commandments of Yahuwah? Or the commandments and the traditions of men?

    Even when the Kingdom comes we will still observe them. Doing so now on earth is rehersing for this. Practice.

    Isaiah 66:22-23

    For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith Yahuwah, so shall your seed and your name remain. And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith Yahuwah.

    //

    My question to you is: Why can we be perfect in keeping all the man made holy days like Christmas, Ester, New Year's and scoff at keeping the Creators appointed days to be observed forever ? And pretend they don't apply ? Up is down, down is up. Crazy.

    And to say nothing about what Yahshua said.
    test
  14. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    I think ur misunderstanding me here.

    ok look just answer this. this only.

    who was the pre covenant law for in its entirety?

    hebrews or gentiles.

    What was the law intended to do. (All ages)

    And who was it created for

    believers or unbelievers?
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  15. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    You're mistaking the covenant as a set of laws. It's not. The law of the Creator was obeyed before the covenant was made with the children of Israel and before the promise was made to Abram.

    The law is for all mankind. Forever. Great topic though...let's keep it going.
    test
  16. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Rectify that idea with

    1 Timothy 1:9

    9 We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers,

    the purpose of the law was to give unbelievers a moral mirror (for lack of a better phrase)
    to give them a sin consciousness

    Romans 3:20 Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin.

    Believers have the conviction of the spirit- which convicts us of our trangressing
    believers have the law written on their hearts-
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  17. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    will do @TheBigPayback

    I'm glad you posted those verses...we shall build understanding together.
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  18. lyricalpriest

    lyricalpriest Rap Games Dawson Creek

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    Yeshua didn't tell you to go to Church but to BE the church.

    John 14:6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

    Ah the good old clobber verse. I don’t know how many times I’ve had this verse thrust at me during my non-Christian days and even today as a Christian. At first glance, it appears to be a tribalistic saying expressing, “If you aren’t a worshiper of Jesus, then you will not get to Heaven.” I’m sure that’s how those who use this verse are intending it to mean too. But with all things concerning the Unknown Father-Mother, this is expressing a mystery that gets lost in literalism, lost in the ways of the world.

    First, we have to identify who Jesus is. In this particular gospel, he is the incarnation of the Logos, the mind of the Unknowable Father-Mother, the Christ. He declares that he is the way, the truth, and the life. This is normally read as if it were a conditional: “If you follow Christ, then you are following the way, the truth, and the life.” But it’s not written as a conditional, but as a declaration. It is also true to say that following the way, the truth, and the life, is to follow Christ.

    Now here’s the part that trips up everyone, including myself for the longest time. “No one comes to the Father except through me.” There we go you have to worship Jesus or else you will not get to heaven...or could this be saying something else? Christ is the Son of God, meaning he is the perfect image of God. He represents what God would be like if God were a man. The teachings and stories associated with Christ are what lead to the Father-Mother. It is not through the worship of particular idols or what religious mandates you follow. It’s through living a life that is compassionate to others (the way), where you are honest with yourself (the truth), and remaining open-minded (the life). This is coming to the Father through Christ.

    Am I advocating that “all roads lead to God”? Not in the slightest. I still affirm that the only way to the Father is through Christ. I just don’t believe that “through Christ” means praying to a dead Jew on a stick or believing in dead letters while remaining willfully ignorant to truth around us and within us.

    2 Corinthians 3:6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant —not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

    Jesus took them all by stealth, for he did not appear as he was, but in the manner in which they would be able to see him. He appeared to them all. He appeared to the great as great. He appeared to the small as small. He appeared to the angels as an angel, and to men as a man. Because of this, his word hid itself from everyone. Some indeed saw him, thinking that they were seeing themselves, but when he appeared to his disciples in glory on the mount, he was not small. He became great, but he made the disciples great, that they might be able to see him in his greatness. - Gospel of Philip
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  19. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    What are u trying to say there^
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  20. lyricalpriest

    lyricalpriest Rap Games Dawson Creek

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    That God Reveals things to those that seek the wisdom and knowledge and it's all obtainable in our bible, and in the other books written around the bible.. ALL things that do nothing but try to describe the state of man, and God...

    I feel like When Jesus said he was the way truth n life, no one goes to the father accept thru him he's saying

    he's shown us the "way" how we should live, and pray "our father" not Dear Jesus..

    he show's that he's the truth by fulfilling prophecy.

    and he show's that he has come to free us from the snares of death, thru eternal life. if we choose to adopt this anti-world mentality, while still remaining compassionate and selfless..

    when he say's the only way to the father is thru him he's actually saying that. THRU his sacrifice MANkind will be able to establish a personal relationship with THE FATHER, not JESUS. Jesus was the SON of GOD. Although he may have been "god incarnate" no where does he say you have to WORSHIP me, he just said you had to accept that what jesus did, he did it for the good of man, to please the father.. anything else then that is adding or taking away from what jesus really was trying to say
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