Coup... enter.

Discussion in 'The Sanctuary' started by Brown Jesus, Apr 23, 2012.

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  1. Brown Jesus

    Brown Jesus Menso is for Dummies

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    Exodus 20:7

    Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.

    Matthew 5:19 NKJV

    Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

    Did I take these put of context, also?
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  2. exodus 31315

    exodus 31315 Kanaan

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    what exactly does it mean to take Yahweh's name in vain?

    to refer to Him without sufficient reverence or with disrespect
    to refer to Him without purpose
    to call on Him without success
    to use His name in a conceited manner
    to use His name without substance or worthiness
    to foolishly use His name

    ???

    i'm not certain
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  3. Brown Jesus

    Brown Jesus Menso is for Dummies

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    The Jews/Hebrews would never attempt a pronunciation. In fact, they probably don't know the pronunciation. If that answers your question.
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  4. exodus 31315

    exodus 31315 Kanaan

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    what? how does that answer my question

    and would that be speculation on your part about whether the Hebrews of Abraham's time would or would not have spoken his name or even known how to? honest question

    because considering this:

    And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them?

    14And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

    15And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, the LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.


    how can you make such a definitive statement?

    but regardless, i really meant my first post in here. in the way Yahweh intended it when giving the Commandment to Moses:

    11Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain: for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.

    do we know in what context/respect this is meant?
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  5. Brown Jesus

    Brown Jesus Menso is for Dummies

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    Speculation? Thee Jews have read Adonai, generally, when confronted with the tetragrammaton. It is logical that the Hebrews had a similar convention. I suppose my point wasn't clear:

    If the Jews/Hebrews wont do it out of fear of potentially taking the Lord's name in vain. Shouldn't we take the same care?

    What if Coup is misspelling it? Very likely given that Hebrew has no vowels. So, in effect, Coup is guessing at the spelling. Or he's been told this by someone else. I think its the latter tbh, but it is essentially the same problem.
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  6. exodus 31315

    exodus 31315 Kanaan

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    just a question man cause when considering that Exodus 3:13-15 verse, Moses quite obviously asks Him what to call Him. and Yahweh answers with YHWH. so excluding Coup's pronunciation or spelling. it's there in Scripture, YHWH himself answering Moses and furthermore telling him to tell Israel this is His name

    what do you mean the Jews have read Adonai? what does that mean?

    and again, do you know with certainty that the people of Abraham's and Moses' time wouldn't refer to Him as YHWH? especially considering Exodus 3:13-15

    i'm a complete novice regarding Scripture, friend so don't take any question or statement made as a challenge or something. genuinely seeking your opinion and more specifically knowledge
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  7. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Freedom From Human Regulations Through Life With Christ

    6So then, just as you received Christ Jesus as Lord, continue to live in him, 7rooted and built up in him, strengthened in the faith as you were taught, and overflowing with thankfulness.

    8See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ.


    9For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form
    , 10and you have been given fullness in Christ, who is the head over every power and authority. 11In him you were also circumcised, in the putting off of the sinful nature,a not with a circumcision done by the hands of men but with the circumcision done by Christ, 12having been buried with him in baptism and raised with him through your faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.


    13When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature,b God made youc alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, 14having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. 15And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.d

    16Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
    17These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.(AMEN) 18Do not let anyone who delights in false humility and the worship of angels disqualify you for the prize. Such a person goes into great detail about what he has seen, and his unspiritual mind puffs him up with idle notions. 19He has lost connection with the Head, from whom the whole body, supported and held together by its ligaments and sinews, grows as God causes it to grow.

    20Since you died with Christ to the basic principles of this world, why, as though you still belonged to it, do you submit to its rules: 21“Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!”? 22These are all destined to perish with use, because they are based on human commands and teachings. 23Such regulations indeed have an appearance of wisdom, with their self-imposed worship, their false humility and their harsh treatment of the body, but they lack any value in restraining sensual indulgence.




    the bible slayin em with truth
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  8. RandomPoster

    RandomPoster New Member

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    You have a good point Exodus. The Jews had a habit of over exaggerating laws to create a buffer so they won't break them. So in fear of taking his name in vain you'll read Jews of today writing G-d out of fear of taking his name in vain. There is even a story in one of the extra books in the Catholic bible that talks about them not defending themselves from attack because it was on the Sabbath.
    That probably wasn't God's intention with that command but superstition and fear led them to that. That's one of the main reasons Jesus was so hard on the religious leaders. They'd taken God's laws and added to them and made them an unbearable weight. Does that make sense?
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  9. Brown Jesus

    Brown Jesus Menso is for Dummies

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    The Translation of the Tetragrammaton

    I'm still fact checking, but this is fairly accurate.
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  10. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    YAHUWAH is His name. Calling him "LORD thy GOD" is not the only way to take YAHUWAH's name in vain. Not obeying His commandments, and teaching that they are nailed to the cross is also taking His name in vain. Willingly doing anything against His WORD and NATURE is taking His name in vain...it's more than saying "GAWD DAMN" Not fearing Him is taking His name in vain...

    BrownJ, why are you qouting commandments out the "OT"...you think they don't apply and are taught to ignore them...that is interesting.

    MATTHEW 5:17-20

    v17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill (perform)

    v18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, on jot or one title shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

    Note: Heaven and earth are still here and have not yet passed.

    v19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach me so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven (lake of fire): but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

    v20 For I say unto you, that except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven

    The scribes and Pharisees KNEW THE LAW as taught in the "old testament" That is deep brothas & sistas...do you know the law, and do you ignore them ?



    II Timothy 3:15
    And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in MESSIYAH Yahshuah

    Paul here is talking about the so called Old Testament scriptures that we are taught to ignore today because they some how "don't apply" Well, he is not talking about the "NT" because it was not written yet in a book or in a bible. And Yahshuah had at this point already rose from the dead and is now at the right hand of the father.
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  11. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    Payback has a gross misunderstanding of what Paul and the Apostles are saying in their letters/Epistles. It's as if he thinks Paul is writing directly to him, today. lmao You have to keep in mind what Paul knew (scriptures) what Yahshuah came to do and what he taught and the context and times of these GentilesNotice paybback says "the bible slayin em with truth" as if he understands the truth of the bible...Humilty goes a long way. You sir are not reading or understanding scriptures. Will you learn ?

    Amazing HALLELUYAH. In none of these verses is Yahahuah teaching that the law's of the MOST HIGH are abolished and nailed to the cross. The judgments are and that is our grace brothas and sistas.


    Dead in your sins is what we would be without our MessiYAH who came to reconcile the House of Ysrael back to the Father, and all Gentiles who are grafted in and worship in spirit and in truth. The written code, was the judgments written in scriptures that punish all sin (sin=transgression of YAH's WORD/Commandments.) That was all nailed to the cross...not the Law itself.



    Paul here was writting a letter to the Gentiles, who knew not YAH and were fresh converts. They are being taught the law, and clean and unclean foods. There is a reason our Father does not want us to eat, for example pork, because it is bad for your health. MessiYAH dying does not make swine still good for you. He is telling these freshly converted Gentiles, who lived among massive amounts of pagans with their pagan philosophies, to not let any one of them tell them what is clean or not. Rather, what does the law say ? Because they were converts now and have to obey the Father's law in spirit and in truth.

    He was also telling them not to let those pagans all around them judge their new high days and days of worship. It is the Sabbath and not Sunday anymore. The moons signs are the ways we, even today, identify the high days of our Father. He was telling them not to be swayed by those pagans all around them...because they are against the Father by their practices.

    These Gentiles in the pagan lands, surrounded by their traditions of men, are now dead to their rudiments and philosophies of the world. These are human commands and teachings...He is not saying that the Father's law are rudiments of the world or are human commands. The Father's word is not wordily, it is unchanging forever, just how He himself is unchanging. He changes not. When you die in MessiYAh you are not to judge the freedom way of life as commanded by the Father against the vain rudiments of the world.

    USA has rudiments, Egypt had rudiments, Babylon had rudiments of the world. But in MessiYAH you are free from that

    You have to read the letters with a historical understanding and with knowledge and understating about what Paul knew (Scriptures), with what the MessiYAH came to do and you have to keep and have a foundation of scriptures in mind.

    Paul is takling about when the Kingdom comes and is established on Earth forever, that all these high days and commandments of the Father as found in Yahshuah's teachings and in the so called old testament will be held true and all true belivers will see and worship with the Father !!!

    IT's DEEP.
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  12. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    it doesnt say to make the laws your God either. pz
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  13. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    and everyone can read we see what it says.


    and we see what u say, ill stick with the bible.
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  14. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    You should stick with the bible, I'm not saying you should not. Also, understand your bible.

    Paul is not teaching the Gentiles to be lawless. He is teaching them to in fact obey the law and ignore the rudiments of the world and not to judge the Father's Law against those rudiments.

    Yahshuah taught the same thing. Why is this so difficult for you to understand. Really ?

    I'm not teaching you nothing but what Paul and Yahshuah taught: KEEP THE LAW.
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  15. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    20Since you died with Christ to the basic principles of this world, why, as though you still belonged to it, do you submit to its rules: 21“Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!”? 22These are all destined to perish with use, because they are based on human commands and teachings. 23Such regulations indeed have an appearance of wisdom, with their self-imposed worship, their false humility and their harsh treatment of the body, but they lack any value in restraining sensual indulgence.


    he is saying godliness is not in YOUR acts of simply keeping the law.
    we are saved by grace because of what christ did. not what YOU do. He is saying to people like you very simply

    QUIT MAKING IT ABOUT YOU. period.
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  16. Brown Jesus

    Brown Jesus Menso is for Dummies

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    Stop saying that i argue that they don't apply, because I didn't. To make a counterargument, and play devils advocate, if you will, then:

    Romans 14

    1Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.

    2For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.

    3Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

    4Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

    5One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

    6He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

    7For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.

    8For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.

    9For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.

    10But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

    11For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

    12So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

    13Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.

    14I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.

    15But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died.

    16Let not then your good be evil spoken of:

    17For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

    18For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men.

    19Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another.

    20For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence.

    21It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.

    22Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.

    23And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.
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  17. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    I have covered this already two times friend. What is it that is played as devil's advocate ? How should I come at this. We can take this scripture above and go many places with it. Scriptures are a living, breathing thing.

    Are you to suggest that by playing devils advocate that Paul is teaching the newly converted Gentiles to be rebellious ?
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  18. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    No hes teaching them what is truely important. The laws God had for a time people used in order to make themselves feel important.

    They even tried to claim superiority over jesus himselves by their upholding of the law, where the claimed he didnt.
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  19. Menso

    Menso Go Lakers!

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    I tire of the games of children. What is Paul's argument in Romans 14, Coup?
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  20. Coup d'état

    Coup d'état Don't believe the hype

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    And what is truly important ? The rudiments of the world that judge the unchanging LAW of the Most High to be nailed to the cross ? The vain philosophies of the Christian religion are what's really important ? making up doctrines of man for the Word of Elohim ?

    Yahshuah's ministry on earth was not really important ?

    No. Paul is teaching the Gentiles, who are new converts to the Hebrew Elohim, to keep the law and let no man judge them for doing so.

    You payback, are in fact the kind of people Paul is referring to when he says don't let them judge you for keeping the law and don't let their vain wordily philosophies keep you from obeying the Father and doing what Yahshuah came to do: fulfill the law and do the Father's will.

    Payback, you are trying to impose your will and your vain religion over the Father's will. You are a false prophet. You are claiming superority over Yahshuah (his name is not jesus) by teaching counter to what YAH sent him to do. YOu are teaching men to disobey and do their own wills.

    Yahshua warned us that whosoever shall teach men to break the commandments of the Father shall be called least in the Kingdom of Heaven (lake of fire).



    The LAW of Elohim is freedom and wise unto salvation. HALLELUYAH the judgments are gone! HalleluYAH for that grace and mercy!!!
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