Children of Palestinian Suicide Bombers.

Discussion in 'IntroSpectrum' started by menaz, Mar 16, 2007.

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  1. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEB0SvMzKzg

    These two kids mother was caught for Adultery.
    So according to sharia law (Islamic law) she disgraced herself .
    So to make up for her sin she choose the Martyrdom of islam.

    These are her two little kids talking.


    VIVA LA REVOLUTION, Reform!

    Someone should adopt those kids and correct their ideology.


    As well as this one too...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9r5iLhreGEg&mode=related&search=

    More AL-islamic child abuse.
    This story this poor little abused girl is reciting is from the Quran.
    What they do not tell this little girl is, that jewish women of Banu Nadir tribe tried to poison mohammad because he slayed her whole family.
    regardless, This little girl should not be informed on religion so young.

    And if I had it my way, No religion of anykind at all would be taught to her.
    test
  2. BeEgEe

    BeEgEe El Warm Shot

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    lol
    test
  3. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    You know, many laws within the sharia have been abolished (such as slavery), just like the mosaic laws in Christianity. It's only the backward wahhabi's who strictly adhere to sharia, not the well-informed, properly guided muslims (who are in majority in the islamic world).

    According to the bible's mosaic laws, if a woman is caught committing adultery, the punishment is death. If a single virgin is raped, the punishment is 500 silver 'sheckles' (money), and if the girl wants, she could marry her victimizer.
    The punishment for raping a woman pledged for marriage is death.


    The point is, they're laws meant only for a certain day and age, and most of the mosaic and sharia laws have been abolished.
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  4. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    That is a lie. Unbelievers are still taken as Booty meaning slaves in islamic nations. They even enslave women and sell them on the black market.
    Christianity never promoted Slavery EVER! Newtestament Text is against
    Slavery. You've never read the new testament. Noone is even talking about slavery by the way.

    That is a lie. That is not in the Newtestament of christianity. that is judaism from the old testament. Which the muslims stole from the Jews and add to their religion. However, the Jews nolonger practice the litteral mosaic laws, Where as Muslims still do practice the Litteral terms for Sharia law. That is the problem with Islam. You don't even know the difference between Christianity New testament and Judaism old testament. LOL!

    No You don't have a point. Because those laws in islam have not been abolished. You are either a blant lair or misinformed. You can't straw man the argument nor can you red herring it.

    WHY CAN'T YOU BE HONEST?
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  5. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    It's also christian scripture. You can't ignore the fact that Christians still follow the old testament too, like for example, the Old Testament prohibits for the brother to marry his sister, or for the son to marry his mother. The New Testament doesn't even talk about it. Does that mean that a Christian brother can marry his sister? or a Christian son can marry his mother? It's also your scripture, and Christians look towards it as a guide.


    As for the Sharia, modern muslims don't follow it. A lot of the ancient laws were abolished in Islam, because they were only meant for a specific time period. And there's radicals everywhere, even in Christian America (just contrasting Christianity with Islam).

    Bible Requires Death By Stoning For "Rebellious" Teenagers, Says PA Preacher

    http://www.commondreams.org/pressreleases/feb99/021899d.htm



    There's radicals of every religion, genius.
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  6. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    Reinventing new arguments.

    They don't follow the oldtestament laws. The old testament is based on Jewish faith. Chrsitians follow the new testament. You don't know what you're talking about. It's morally secular, Not to marry your sister or mother. I am not a Jew or christian yet I know not to marry my sister or mother. It's a Morality installed in everyone. You're argument again has nothing to do with the subject as usual.


    I'm for all religion being abolished. I just know Islam is the wrost out of the bunch. because unlike Judaism it has not progressed with the centuries.

    Wrong, Apostate muslims don't follow it. None of the ancient laws in the nations of islam have been abolished. That's just it, thrilla, Islam has not progressed with the centuries. That is the problem. And jews are not christians Because Christianity comes from one source the new testament. And unlike Islam christianity peaches to turn the other cheek, Instead of Forcing unbelievers to accept islam or become Dhimmies. America is Seperation from church and state, Islamic nations are not. And in America the citizen have due process rights, In Sharia law, there is no due process, it is left up to the law of Allah. Moreover, Jesus also taught, do not cast stones.


    You are the product of disinformation.

    http://news.scotsman.com/topics.cfm?tid=1081&id=987592003
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  7. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    Oh so they don't follow the ten commandments? [​IMG] Idiot.

    They still follow some of the old laws, they look to the old testament as a guide. They don't follow the mosaic laws anymore, but they still learn from the old testament.

    Jesus stated "he didn't come to abolish to old laws" in Matthew 5:17-18 and also stated, himself, to follow some of the old laws in Mathew 22:37-40



    More like you haven't progressed with time, you're still an idiot.

    If you knew anything about the qu'ran, the laws of capital punishment have expiations involved. Islam doesn't believe in forced conversions, you're crazy, truly. I think a muslim would know more about their religion than you, and it shows through me. Your the one who needs to open his eye's, not me. Your arrogance reeks


    Example of Islam adapting with time & culture:

    Sharia is an ancient law back in the "flintstone" era. Now, we have better technological advances (such as forensics) to deal with matters, but before these advances the only way they could prosecute a rapist [for example] was to summon any possible witnesses who could confirm what happened. You know, many laws within the sharia have been abolished (such as slavery), just like the mosaic laws in Christianity. It's only the backward wahhabi's who strictly adhere to sharia law, not the well-informed, properly guided muslims. Islam adapts to culture, modern muslims know this, and it's only the wahhabi's who think backwards like this [who think they're "riving" and "restoring" islam back to its original "pure" state]


    Tunisia, Lebanon, and Turkey even banned polygamy.

    Actually, Turkey, Tunisia, and Lebanon made polygamy illegal [their interpretation of islam finds polygamy unnecessary in this day and age] and they also don't stone people to death who commit adultery, or send them to jail either [All muslim countries do not stone people to death for adultery, to my best recollection].
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  8. cock juggler

    cock juggler Double ML=STUD

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  9. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    No they don't. How manytimes do I have to tell you this.
    That is the old testament. Christians follow the newtestament.
    That is it. The new testament was a proselytizing to Oldtestament jews.
    You know nothing yet you keep Typing? You clearly know nothing about
    these three religions. Honestly, You're putting me in a weird postion, because I don't care about christians or Jews. but you're lying and that needs correction.

    Wrong. And this proves you google and have no idea what your talking about EVER. not on islam. not on christianity. Not on Judaism. You are def, dumb, and blind. When you die the dead will not recognize you.

    I will explain to you what that means.... unlike you I can explain myself.

    Jesus did not come to this earth for the purpose of acting as an adversary of the law. His goal was not to frustrate its fulfillment. Rather, he revered it, loved it, obeyed it, and brought it to fruition. He fulfilled the law’s prophetic utterances regarding himself (Lk. 24:44).

    Christ fulfilled the demands of the Mosaic law, which called for perfect obedience or else imposed a “curse” (see Gal. 3:10,13). In this sense, the law’s divine design will ever have an abiding effect. It will always accomplish the purpose for which it was given. By fullfilling the Mosaic law he Abloished it.

    so, if one contends, on the basis of Matthew 5:17-18, that Moses’ law is still binding as a legally required regime, he must take all of it—including its bloody sacrifices As Paul later will argue—if a man receives one portion of the law [as binding for justification, he is a debtor to do "all of it" (Gal. 5:3). "ALL OF IT!" Ironically muslims still pratice bloody Eid al-Adha on Zul-Hijja.

    In addition to the points I listed above, Paul clearly argues, in his letter to the Ephesians, that the “law of commandments contained in ordinances” was “abolished” by the death of Jesus upon the cross (2:14-15). The Greek term for “abolished” is "katargeo", literally suggesting the idea of reducing something to a state of inactivity.


    Paul uses this term twice in Romans 7:2,6—showing that just as a wife is “discharged” from the law of her husband when he dies, even so, through the death of the body of Christ, men were “discharged” from the obligations of the Mosaic law. That the law here contemplated is the law of Moses, including the ten commandments, is demonstrated by the reference to the tenth commandment in Romans 7:7 (cf. Ex. 20:17).


    That is how jesus intended it. That is how christians of the newtestament see it. However, Islamic nations still Pratice and carry out Sharia law as Mohammad and Allah demanded it to this day. If Muslims ignore one of ALLAH'S LAWS or mohammads commands, They are not muslims. They have fallen off the Islamic path. And are considered murtadd muslims. However, it's much deeper than that.

    Murtadd Fitri - These are Apostates who were born muslim.
    Murtadd Milli - These are Apsostates who converted to muslim.
    To which then the Sharia law says they should be Put to death...

    For the following acts....

    Any verbal denial of any principle of Muslim belief is considered apostasy. If one declares, for example, that the universe has always existed from eternity or that God has a material substance, then one is an apostate. If one denies the unity of God or confesses to a belief in reincarnation, one is guilty of apostasy. Certain acts are also deemed acts of apostasy, for example treating a copy of the Koran disrespectfully, by burning it or even soiling it in some way. Some doctors of Islamic law claim that a Muslim becomes an apostate if he or she enters a church, worships an idol, or learns and practises magic. A Muslim becomes an apostate if he defames the Prophet’s character, morals or virtues, and denies Muhammad’s prophethood and that he was the seal of the prophets. There is no free speech.


    Sura II.217, is interpreted by no less an authority than al-Shafi'i (died 820 C.E.), the founder of one of the four schools of law of Sunni Islam to mean that the death penalty should be prescribed for apostates. Sura II.217 reads: "… But whoever of you recants and dies an unbeliever , his works shall come to nothing in this world and the next, and they are the companions of the fire for ever.” Al-Thalabi and al -Khazan concur. Al-Razi in his commentary on II:217 says the apostate should be killed.

    IV. 89: And it gones on and on: “They would have you disbelieve as they themselves have disbelieved, so that you may be all like alike. Do not befriend them until they have fled their homes for the cause of God. If they desert you seize them and put them to death wherever you find them. Look for neither friends nor helpers among them…” Baydawi (died c. 1315-16), in his celebrated commentary on the Koran, interprets this passage to mean: “Whosover turns back from his belief "irtada" openly or secretly, take him and kill him wheresoever ye find him, like any other infidel. Separate yourself from him altogether. Do not accept intercession in his regard”. Ibn Kathir in his commentary on this passage quoting Al Suddi (died 745) says that since the unbelievers had manifested their unbelief they should be killed.

    Moving on!
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  10. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    No But I am dealing with one named, thrilla.




    there is a Expiation for Adultry in islam.
    And it was what that lady choose, To blow herself up for Martyrdom. Whoopie! Moreover, When a gay man is flogged, Banished, or Murdered.
    That isn't right, that's a human being Muslims Outcast, hurt, kill, or are just in general Pyhsically mistreating. Why? because they block up traffic once year, and suck dick? Islam does believe in Forcing converstions. Infact, Mohammad fought many waring battles with the his old pagan tribe the Quraish before they Gave in and accepted islam. Noone took Mohammad serious accept you for those he conqured. Moreover, The Quraish did not Proscute muslims for their faiths, However, The muslims did Procute them for their faiths.


    People know you are lying.

    The truth is still the same today as it was then, The problem is women can't provide a witness. Islam nations are ruled by Parahtiy. women's testimony counts half that of men.far more women than men are stoned to death for adultery.


    Slavery has not been abolished in Islam.

    et still almost 200 years later slave raids and the sale of slaves in muslim markets continues, especially in countries like Sudan The slave trade was legal in Saudi Arabia till 1962: Untill "international pressure" finally abolished it not muslims. Yet infact, credible reports, note that slavery in Saudi Arabia still persist, and that slaves from the Sudan often end up there in Saudi Arabia Recent slave, Mende Nazer, "Slave: My true life": Nazer was captured in 1992 First she was a slave to a rich Arab family in Khartoum And by 2002 she was a slave to a Sudanese diplomat in London, From whom she managed to escape and get political asylum.

    In Sudan, Christians are sold into slavery or murdered for no other crime than naming the Name of Christ. Over two million have been murdered, and 200,000 have been sold into slavery by their government. An organization named Christian Solidarity International (PLEASE visit C.S.I.'s website listed in Resources Section) has raised money to buy almost 60,000 slaves from their captors and free them.

    You can't tell me Slavery is abloished. it Still goes on and the governments turn a blind eye because they don't agree with the western secular laws they believe in the inhumane Sharia laws. http://www.americandaily.com/article/8172



    The Wahhabi are not Misinformed.
    They are carrying out Islam as Mohammad Intended it.
    You are the Misguided one. This doesn't seem to click with you.
    Hate to be slightly mean here, but do you have a learning disability?
    You just admited what I have been dying to here you say at the end
    Islam original state. The Problem with Islam that is not in Christianty
    or Judaism is You are a Apostate muslim according to the Hadith and
    Quran which means, you are a unbeliever. But you talk out of two sides
    of your mouth like your conflicted with which way to go. Anyone who denies Sharia law is not what Nations of Islam follow is liar or very misinformed.

    Why are you defending Sharia law? it's very much alive today and still inhuman as it was in the 8th century. You should be following the Canadian Laws and fighting against Shariah law, Which by the looks of it, You don't. That would make you somewhat SANE to me though if you did!

    Actually, Tunisia and trukey are the only islamic countries to ban Polygamy. Muslims don't stone People to death? Your Recollection is wrong.Muslims nations still litterally follow an eye for an eye.

    http://www.corpun.com/ngj00501.htm

    That's a canning.^

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/3313207.stm

    court in Pakistan has sentenced a man to be blinded by acid^.

    http://www.faithfreedom.org/Announcement/412151150.htm

    Iran stoning a women to death for Adultery. ^


    Don't send people to jail? I guess they don't kidnap and hold other Muslims captive either? RIGHT!!!!! http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5077180.stm jails exists and people in those jails exist.

    Sharia law is adapting to shit, You're a motherfucking lair as usual.
    test
  11. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    The biblical jesus indeed changed the law (which is obvious) he never "fulfilled it" that's ludicrous. Change is change, there's no beating around the bush, the bible contradicts itself numerous times, and that's what happened here. Christians still follow the 10 commandments (from the old testament) and learn from the old testament (they use it as a guide). You clearly stated they don't follow laws from the old testament (10 commandments etc..), and i proved your ass wrong yet again (100th time now?).

    Muhammad pbuh never was a pagan, you're a satanic liar. He never killed people for not being muslims, yet another satanic lie. I was referring to the law of "an eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth..." There's expiations involved. Apostasy does not = death in islam, you're a satanic liar. I clarified this already in the other thread.


    Yea right. I guess all those scholars are "apostates" too, who pray five times a day? It's not clicking with you. How many people on this website think your stupid? I know of numerous occasions where people called you an "idiot"
    Wahhabi's are a minority sect, and whatever they claim is scrutinized and rejected by the orthodox muslim world (the majority). As a matter of fact, you're no different than a wahhabi, because your thinking is just as narrow as theirs.

    I'm defending the methods of it, because you don't understand it enough to be critical of it, and act as if though you know everything about the subject at hand.

    Just to prove my point

    "In the modern Islamic world, polygamy is mainly found in traditionalist Arab cultures, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates for instance, whereas in secular Arab states like Lebanon and non-Arab countries with Muslim population, Turkey for example, it is banned. It is also illegal in Tunisia." - Wiki

    And if you think wiki is not credible, you can do a web search your self.


    Your own country follows capital punishment, so what's your point stupid?

    Pakistan does not follow hudood anymore, Again, I will prove this through wiki (and if you think it isn't credible, you can do your own research)

    "The Hudood Ordinance was a law in Pakistan, that was abolished in 2006. It has been replaced by the Women's Protection Bill. Originally, the Hudood Law was ostensibly intended to implement Muslim Shari'a law, which enforces punishments mentioned in the Quran and sunnah for a number of crimes, including extra-marital sex (zina), the drinking of alcohol, and theft. It was enacted in 1979 as part of then military ruler Zia-ul-Haq's Islamization process."

    Remember what I told you about how these laws were only meant for a certain period in history, and that there's better technological advances now, which can bring criminals to justice. I told you Islam adapts to time and culture.


    This document is in 2003 Zia ul-Haq's laws have been abolished in 2006

    I actually agree to an 'eye for en eye' for heinous crimes, are you kidding me? The guy mutilated the woman and poured acid on her, he deserves the death sentence. This guy would've been executed in the southern united states.

    But anyways here's what I got from your own article

    "The law allows for a like-for-like punishment unless clemency is agreed by the victim's family."

    "Rights groups have criticized the sentence and observers say it is unlikely to be carried out."

    "The sentence can be appealed and Qisas rulings are often altered by higher courts. "

    LOL faithfreesom.org that website is a joke, it's a website based on hate. Anyways, Iran is a shiia country, and the educated people of Iran (students etc..) say the people in power don't practice islam properly. They argue most laws within sharia have been abolished in islam, and that islam adapts to time (just check out the protests). The Khomeini is scrutinized by the islamic world, don't believe me check it out for yourself, you google scholar.

    Okay, your just retarded as usual. That article is concerning an Iranian prison, just read the heading "Inside Iran's most notorious jail"
    Go write a letter to the Iranian president expressing your concern about this notorious prison, don't bring that sh!t to me LOL
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  12. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    1.

    Womens testimonies are not counted as half a mans (already explained this in the other thread), that's a lie.
    The penalties for hudood offenses have not been adopted in all Islamic countries. Any country that followed the guide lines in the past didn't even carry it out, such as pakistan, they would sentence them to jail instead. However, Pakistan abolished the hudood ordinances in 2006

    Since you make claims, you need to back them up.
    Prove that all islamic nations follow what you stated above. Provide us with evidence of women getting "stoned to death", Prove Islamic nations are like that today, show evidence. Prove Turkey, Bosnia, Lebanon, Palestine, Tunisia, Jordan, Egypt etc.. follow it. Like I said before, you're a satanic liar.

    2.

    The slave trade in Sudan is one country. Those are black people enslaving other black people. Yet they represent the Islamic world, how?
    The problem in Sudan is a political one, not an islamic one.
    The ruling National Islamic Front (NIF) won less than 10% of the votes of Muslim Sudanese in the last free elections. It uses religious rhetoric in its war propaganda, to try to rally international Islamic support. Some Christian groups have fallen into the same trap, forgetting that the government is oppressing Muslims as well as non-Muslims. The civil war is fundamentally about political power and social disadvantage, about intolerance rather than religious faith.

    2. a)

    So menaz, the KKK and the preacher in Pennsylvania represent what Christianity is all about? Or how about those morons (i mean mormons) bombing abortion clinics? You say the actions of others define a religion, however, it's only islam you target. Not only that, your thinking is narrow, just because the actions of a few, you target the whole religious doctrine.
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  13. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    You honestly, Have no rationale to keep repeating the same disproven argument over and over.

    No you didn't. Again you're not listening. you are pointless, You can't read for shit. This is the last time i'm pointing this out to your mental illness. You must take into account every Masonic law which you don't, you only point to the 10 commandments. Inorder for your insertion of proof to be true, You must correlate 613 mitzvot (commandments) to christians. But you can't because Christians do not follow mosaic laws. That is in the torah not the new testament. That part of your argument is a red herring. therefore is a fallacy. You have been diproved in the above thread. You're just saying the same shit over and over because your pissed off it's not true. Sorry you opened your mouth about something you know nothing about and I had to disprove you. You're argument keeps changing everytime you are disproved. Also stop with the straw man arguments, Your logic is to call christians jews which is a illogical statement of proof by insertion as I pointed out. LOL! stop being a moron. Only two commandments Christians follow are love thy neighbor like thyself and love thy lord god..




    No, peace shall not be upon him at all. And oh correction he was a pagan.
    LOL@ satanic lair. How Ironic, The Quran does have satanic verses. Correction Apostate does equal death in islam. Stop replying just to reply. You're a waste of fucking time. You didn't even know your socalled prophet was a pagan. LOL!


    Well a poll was taken and I was voted one of the smartest people on the site.Not that I care, Because I know what i'm saying here is the truth anyway. You're childish attacks mean nothing to me. LOL! No you are the Wahhabi, you protect Sharia law. I do not protect sharia law. Not to mention, Wahhabi follows Isalm as it was intended. So I believe there Knowledge of Isalm is actually not only better than mine but yours as well.


    Is this coming from the same kid who claimed he doesn't know islam entirely? Yes I believe it is and your ignorence and wrongful understandings on sharia law is weighing thin with me. I've already caught you in many misunderstandings and lies, Keep talking, I'll keep pointing out were you're wrong and were you lie.




    If we look at actual practices in the Muslim world, only Tunisia and Turkey have banned polygamy. In 1956, Tunisia enacted the Tunisian Code of Personal Status which provides one year of imprisonment or a fine for a man to engage in polygamy.

    http://www.law.northwestern.edu/news/article_full.cfm?eventid=3027

    I'll give you Tunisia and Turkey, Then again, If you would have read.
    I already gave you both countries. Two fucking countries, Whoopie doo!

    my point, You don't know the differnece between a criminal law and Eye for an eye. And you have the nerve to call me stupid? LOL!
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  14. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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  15. menaz

    menaz Avant Garde

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    frist i'd like to say, This happens in other Islamic countries too, speically the one I named, Iran. No it's not a lie. but you are a liar.

    Volume 3, Book 48, Number 826:
    Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:

    The Prophet said, "Isn't the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?" The women said, "Yes." He said, "This is because of the deficiency of a woman's mind."


    http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/005631.php
    http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=13321
    http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/006375.php

    they Also want seperate courts in Australia. they also want sperate courts
    in Canada. The idea's for Sharia law will speard, And it will because good men
    didn't stand up against evil. If you are a apostate muslim as you retardly
    claim, This means you did nothing.


    I did back them up. I have been backing them up. You either A.) ignore it.
    B.) Lie C.) are misinformed. or D.) change the subject and interject
    with a straw man, redherring, or Proof by assertion. all fallacies.

    How about you try to Prove they don't? You made the claim first that they are all mordernized. I have proven they are not all like that. Only thing you've proven is Polygamy is not allowed in Tusgina or Trukey. And that Pakastine has a Three law systems in effect that contradicts each other. This line of reasoning from you is called a Ad nauseam Proof by assertion arguement. LOL! nice Subconscious try.





    I love how you are ok with Slavery in the sudan like it's no big deal. Those are muslims enslaving other people - from pagan blacks - christians - The problem is not just the islamic government in sudan it is the outside islamic forces brought in as well such as the Janjaweed. You Commit the error of not recogizing That 200,000 christians is no small number of people being enslaved by muslims. Not to mention, the countless of Blacks being enslaved by muslims as well. You also fail to recognize that this war is three parts, Religious oppression, Control for the vast sudan oil fields, and of course to gain back islamic power. And lastly, the enslaves are transported from Sudan and continuously sold all over the Islamic nations.





    You are making a grave error again.

    Christianity is about what jesus said it is about in the newtestament.
    If people do not follow it they are not christians, hence your error.
    When a Muslim follows Islam as Mohammad said they should they are following it as intended This means, the Ideology of Sharia law. They have not modernized fully. Pakastain is in a transitional stage, With three laws. one being sharia. The west needs to make sure they continue to adapt fully.

    Mormons are not christians. their beliefs are very different, they read the Book of Mormons .. And like the muslims they believe in Polygamy. And they don't believe in jesus.

    Yes I do target the whole religion doctrine, Because muslims follow it and all the Militantcy acts commited are because of the ideology it preaches as i've pointed out. You are not above critism. no religion is. the only one with a Flatlining knowledge on all religion is you. The only thing bring the change is western thinking.
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  16. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

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    Notice. very carefully here. that Prophet Muhammad said "woman's mind" and not "woman's brain". No where in the qu'ran do we see any ridiculous uneducated and unscientific claim against women or anyone. The women's brains and ability to think is not what is being criticized here. Since men were more experienced in financial transactions, the mind of a man would be more ideal in this case (since they were more experienced in financial transactions).

    This verse is pertaining to a certain time period. And this same example is in the qu'ran.

    Two women take the place of one man, because one woman can remind the other not to be biased. Generally, men were more ideal witnesses during this era, because they were more experienced in financial transactions.

    Qu'ran [2:282] " ....then a man and two women, such as ye choose, for witnesses, so that if one of them errs, the other can remind her."

    *2:282 Financial transactions are the ONLY situations where two women may substitute for one man as witness. This is to guard against the real possibility that one witness may marry the other witness, and thus cause her to be biased.

    A womans testimony is equal to a mans (and vice versa) in the case of launching a charge of adultery against their spouses. This is proof that the testimony of a woman is not the half of a mans

    Dr. Muzammil H. Siddiqi comments:

    “There is no discrimination between a wife and husband in the case of Li'an. If the wife accuses her husband or the husband accuses his wife, in both cases they will have to produce evidence. In the absence of evidence they have to do the Li'an. After the Li’an, both parties are separated. They are not husband and wife. However, if the wife accused her husband of adultery and then she refused to do the Li'an then in this case she will be punished for Qadhaf. In correlation, if the husband accused his wife of adultery and then when asked to do Li'an he balked, then he will be punished for Qadhaf. Both parties are treated equally in this law. Adultery is Haram for man as it is for woman. There is no special treatment for men or women in this case.”
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  17. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2003
    Messages:
    4,870
    Your own country allows an "eye for an eye" [​IMG] and Pakistan also has a process of prosecution, they don't just kill the guy as soon as he gets convicted of the crime, he has to be prosecuted in a court. most, if not all islamic countries are like that, this is substantial proof that you're an idiot, anyone can see this. Ofcourse criminals are prosecuted in court, you act as if they get hanged as soon as they get charged for the offence. You also made a false claim that people get stoned to death in pakistan, which i fully countered with swift prosperity, and as usual, you look like a fool. I told you that many laws within sharia were abolished, because islam adapts with time and culture, however, some fundamental laws do not change (capital punishment).

    For instance, since we aren't in the era of slavery anymore (when that was how society conducted itself, the social norm), slavery laws within sharia are void and abolished. Also. the law of producing four witnesses in the case of rape is also void and abolished (there's better technological advances now to convict a rapist, which wasn't present in the 7th century). And Pakistan wasn't really influenced by the west to reform the law, many scholars within pakistan and international scholars opposed it, stating it didn't reflect the true spirit of islam. Also, the opposing governments of Benazir Bhutto and Nawaz Sharif also agreed to a reform of the law. Not only that, but the general society of Pakistan were seriously recommending a reform of the law as well. So it was Pakistan that made this decision, not the west.

    The prophet muhammad pbuh said use your best judgment.

    Authoritative and respected scholars of all four schools of islam (hanafi, malaki, shafii'i, hanbali)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunni_Islam

    ALL agree that Islam adapts to time and culture, and if you disagree with this, your in a serious error. Laws within sharia, such as capital punishment, laws regarding marriage and charity (zakat) etc... have not changed because they still apply today. Obviously the procedures of prosecuting a rapist does not apply today, because of our technological advances (DNA evidence, foot/finger prints etc..), which is why the hudood ordinance was reformed in the first place.


    BBC reports

    "The penalties for hudud offences have not been adopted in all Islamic countries. Many predominantly Muslim countries, such as Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon and Syria, have not adopted the hudud penalties in their criminal justice systems."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/people/features/ihavearightto/four_b/casestudy_art07.shtml

    You claim the system contradicts itself, but all systems have loop-holes. Even your own American system have laws which contradict each other. However, Pakistani laws have been reformed in such a way, that it limits this.



    And you don't? Wow that's inhumane, just think of the families of the victims of heinous crimes. I think you're the one that's inhumane, maybe if someone in your family was a victim of such a crime, you would beg to differ.


    What are you talking about? If someone mutilated a woman and poured acid on her in one of the southern states (lets say texas) that man would be on death row right now awaiting execution. You can't beat around the bush, even though you try so hard [​IMG]




    Revenge? Revenge is an act carried out by the citizen(s), not the justice system. All crimes that are prosecuted under a court of law can be defined as "revenge" with your train of thought then. Pakistan supports an "eye for an eye..." and that is what is was.




    The truth is, that website is biased, and incorrect (maybe correct to you but not me). The Khomeini doesn't practice the true spirit of Islam, he is uneducated and it shows. That's why he faces alot of scrutiny from the orthodox muslim communities world wide, and also from the educated muslims in his own country (professors, students etc..).



    I never stated that muslim countries don't put people in jail. Since when do muslim countries do not have jails, let alone any country? Your crazy
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  18. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2003
    Messages:
    4,870
    The first article is regarding divorces (not even concerning what you quoted). They weren't proposing sharia law as a whole, just regarding family matters/divorces. It's not like they were starting a war for it, they just wanted to handle divorces islamically

    "In Muslim countries, a disputed break-up is settled by a special sharia court. But these don't exist in Australia and citizens who want to remarry must travel overseas to get a judgment."


    As for the last two articles, i live in toronto, and there's no "push" from muslims in canada to adapt to islamic criminal laws what-so-ever here. Those are the opinions of a few somalian refugee's and one spokesman, and the only reason why it was being proposed was because of family matters/divorce. They didn't summon sharia law to be imposed on every canadian, but just 1 or 2 aspects of it for themselves (only muslims who want to use it, can)

    Human Rights Announcements notes: “Firstly, this is an issue of law and not religion per se.

    Secondly, the scope of such a court is only in the sphere of personal family law so do not entertain thoughts on the criminal law aspects of the Sharia.”


    They're only proposing family law and not the criminal aspects of sharia anyways.


    You're trying to portray an image that "extrmists" exist in canada and australia, who are trying to push for criminal laws of sharia, when that's is completely false. They're proposing one or two aspects of the law, which is concerning family matters and marriage.

    You're suggesting that muslims in canada & australia want to turn the country into an "islamic state" (you're delirious). Also, a lot of the arguments in that article are false claims against islam. And a lot of them are biased.
    "Dhimmi watch" is a biased website as well (not surprised).


    No, you can't admit you're wrong.

    1)You said Islam does not adapt with time/culture, and i provided two countries that even banned polygamy (let alone, polygamy is next to non-existent in the islamic world now). Also, I have told you that in the majority of Muslim countries, the Sharia is applied selectively. And majority of muslim countries adopt only a few aspects of Sharia law ........(many mid-east countries don't adopt sharia criminal offenses/hudud, SUCH AS: palestine, egypt, jordan, syria, lebanon, turkey etc..). This is a blunt example of Islam adapting with time.

    2)After, you said the only country that banned polygamy was Tunisia, now you're including Turkey. In most muslim countries polygamy is next to non-existent anyways. Which is another example of islam adapting to time and culture.

    3) You said the government of Pakistan sentences people to get "stoned to death" which wasn't true, and i corrected you on it.

    And since you asked me to prove my other claims

    BBC

    "In countries such as Saudi Arabia, Iran and Sudan, which are governed by Islamists who view Islam as a political ideology as well as a personal faith, a strict interpretation of the Sharia serves as the supreme law of the land.

    In the majority of Muslim countries, however, the Sharia is applied selectively. Some countries adopt only a few aspects of Sharia law; others apply the entire code."

    "The penalties for hudud offences (sharia criminal offenses) have not been adopted in all Islamic countries. Many predominantly Muslim countries, such as Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon and Syria etc... have not adopted the hudud penalties in their criminal justice systems."

    Other countries include: Turkey, Albania, Bosnia, Palestine etc..


    Many muslim countries don't adopt the criminal laws of sharia (hudood offences) into their justice system. I told you before, the majority of muslim countries don't "stone people to death (like you said)" if not any, anymore. In many muslim countries Sharia law is applied selectively, because many of the laws within sharia have been abolished (islam adapts to time and culture).

    This is a blunt example of Islam adapting with time.
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  19. Thrilla-Ali

    Thrilla-Ali Dapper Don

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2003
    Messages:
    4,870
    Criminal laws within sharia/hudud have been reformed in most muslim countries, and they're not even practiced in many other one's. Islam agree's to adapting with time and culture, whether you agree or not (who cares).

    First off, I never stated i was okay with slavery in Sudan, I said leave Islam out of this, because their actions aren't Islamic and shouldn't reflect Islam. It's already been established that you're a satanic liar and distorter. For real, the actions of a certain militia group within northern sudan does not define what islam is about, nor are their actions islamic in any shape or form. You seem to have bypassed this info so i will present it again:

    "The ruling National Islamic Front (NIF) won less than 10% of the votes of Muslim Sudanese in the last free elections. It uses religious rhetoric in its war propaganda, to try to rally international Islamic support. Some Christian groups have fallen into the same trap, forgetting that the government is oppressing Muslims as well as non-Muslims. The civil war is fundamentally about political power and social disadvantage, about intolerance rather than religious faith."

    1)I bring you back to my example of the KKK and how they justify their views from the holy bible (i can prove this by providing information from the web). The KKK claim the bible speaks on behalf of black people and other minorities as "evil" and that "the beast (blacks)" need to be eradicated.

    2)You claim that mormons aren't christians, and in the same likeliness, i say qutbists aren't muslim, you need to grasp the paradox I'm making, instead of reacting like a retarded person.

    3)The preacher in Pennsylvania was christian, and there are many radicals like him in the southern united states, especially around the "bible belt (south, mid-west)" where Protestant, baptist, and methodist fundamentalism is widely practiced.

    4)Talking about radical beliefs, what about Evangelicalism in the south? What about "jesus camp?"

    "Jesus Camp is a 2006 documentary directed by Rachel Grady and Heidi Ewing about a Pentecostal summer camp for children who spend their summers learning and practicing their "prophetic gifts" and being taught that they can "take back America for Christ.". According to the distributor, it "doesn't come with any prepackaged point of view", and it tries to be "an honest and impartial depiction of one faction of the evangelical Christian community”

    5)I singled out the philosophy which osama bin laden follows (qutbism), and how different(radical) it was from what most muslims follow, yet you become even more shallow in your responses (no different from being speechless).

    You certainly are not intelligent, and the only people who voted for you (how little there are) were probably just as lame as you.


    SUMMARY

    I gave you examples of both christian people & christian denominations in your own country, that twist the meanings of christianity, and aren't accepted by the standard christian communities. Yet, you defend Christianity in America with all your honor stating it's "different" then what you're suggesting about Islam? You're a hypocrite as well as a liar. You can't even challenge me at the source of this discussion, which is the holy Qu'ran (your a joke).


    Menaz, prove wahhabi's (a minority group) represent "true islam"
    Prove that Osama Bin Laden represents "true islam"
    And that most muslims are not "real muslims" but are apostates (people who "left" islam).

    So prove to me that the majority of muslims in the world are "apostates" and that we left islam some how *retard alert*

    You claim most muslims are "fake muslims" and that a minority group known as "wahhabi's" define "true islam" yet you can't prove this. Your a google-scholar, and nothing more. You claim you know my faith, but in reality your just a waste of time (that knows nothing about the religion of Islam) Every muslim who encounters you agree's that you're an idiot (no surprise there). Your sources are biased, and so are you.

    I give you an open challenge to prove that wahhabi-islam was the "real islam" You may present scripture to "support" your brittle argument.

    Actually, you made yet another error, they do believe in Jesus. And everyone has the freedom to marry who they wish, if the women agree to sharing a husband, what do you care? The prophets in the bible had many wives, does that make christianity and judaism "wrong" too?

    But to wrap things up, you have no clue what islamic ideology is, or what it preaches (and it shows), because your an arrogant bigot.
    I never believed you were intelligent, and I always thought of you as the website idiot (your so ignorant and stupid that it's overwhelming to even think that anyone could see you as "intelligent")


    Now don't foam at the mouth, and start ballin' after reading this [​IMG]

    you pathetic little man [​IMG]

    Now don't wet your pants kid
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  20. SAMARA

    SAMARA truth is a sword

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2002
    Messages:
    1,151
    im at a lost for words...

    mama rim?

    the children believe, on sorry "recite" their mother is no longer with them because she is in paradise, and they are left in hell.

    what a good mother.



    im disgusted.
    test
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