anyone not understand the trinity?

Discussion in 'IntroSpectrum' started by TheBigPayback, Nov 27, 2010.

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  1. reggie_jax

    reggie_jax rapper noyd

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    yea... they are same in essence meaning in spirit, right? but they are distinct from one another, they have interactions, making them separate entities. you can say they're one entity acting in three forms, to me that just sounds like a clever loophole.

    this just seems directly contradictory to the jewish god hashem, who always sort of made a point of the fact that he is the one and only god.
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  2. reggie_jax

    reggie_jax rapper noyd

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    but since jesus was referred to as the son of god, i thought that given the context those verses where he refers to his 'father' are in reference to god? after all, who created jesus? are the labels 'father' and 'son' to be taken to imply a chronology?
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  3. reggie_jax

    reggie_jax rapper noyd

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    also.. what do you mean by 'the godhead is abstract?'

    the 3 figures are distinct and literal, as you said. i thought the 'godhead' was the overall concept of god which includes all 3 key players. if the overall concept of god which supposedly unites the three figures as one force is 'abstract,' haven't you just devolved to polytheism? instead of one literal entity acting through 3 metaphorical figureheads you have 3 literal and distinct figures acting on behalf of one abstract unifying concept.
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  4. Noncentz

    Noncentz Sieg Heil, M'fer!

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    Yes, I do.

    It's a fairy tale within a fairy tale book called the Bible.
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  5. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Theres prophecy and science to back up biblical accounts so no matter how u look at it u cant just set that aside. Sorry.
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  6. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    I'll quickly reply to this now, and I'll get to the other stuff when I get to it.

    First off, the 'Father' and the 'Son' are not labels. When you ask who created Jesus, assuming that God the Father created him, you are missing one important thing; that is, no one created Jesus in essence. The Son is begotten of the Father.

    In relation to God, the word father is used in certain instances in the Bible to refer to the first person of the Trinity, and in other instances to refer to God.

    The Father as the first person of the Trinity is God, but so is the Son, God, and so is the Holy Spirit, God. As I said, the Son was begotten of the Father, they are not just labels. And the Spirit proceeds from the Father. They are of the same essence and are one God. They can't be divided.

    In respect to chronology, the Father comes first. No one comes to the Father except through Jesus Christ. The Son comes second. The Holy Spirit that proceeds from the Father comes third.

    They are distinct. They have different roles. But it is the will of the Father that is carried out ultimately.

    I didn't actually intend to address more of the Trinity stuff in this post when I started, so I'll cut myself short on that for now and I'll come back to your other posts later.
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  7. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    First off, I have to wonder: You appear to know a lot more about this than you let on earlier, I'm getting the vibe that you've heard this all before? I don't see how this could be anything other than a giant waste of time for you?

    And I mean they share the same essence of supreme being or deity foremost. This is inherent in them, and there is not one other of these which can be drawn from.

    If you take issue with that as an answer, then you're asking me to specify what are the minimal inherencies to subsist as God?
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  8. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    I wasn't to imply that the Godhead has no substantive basis in reality. You seem to grasp what the Godhead is, and perhaps explanation was even clearer than I had thought without needing to clarify. I said that the Godhead was the make up of the Trinity, not mentioning that it the concept of the unity - which is why I bandied about 'abstract' in regard to the Godhead - being that I don't see it as a power overriding the three persons or subsistencies. Basically God is sovereign.
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  9. Nu'maaN

    Nu'maaN Anu'naki, Nuqqa.

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    ^ reggie knows his shit, he's been here for a while.

    thank you, he tried to answer my same question on three different occasions. three strikes payback, you out. and as for him hearing voices, he made a thread about that.


    this is by far the most refreshing information i've read about this trinity thing, thank you.

    so if the almighty is distinct from jesus, this can't make jesus god. right? because jesus was created. nobody created god ...

    [turn] ...
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  10. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    they arent swperate they are attribute of one thing mainly like us body soul and spirit yet we are ine thing
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  11. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    also the son of man
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  12. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    Just reading back what I wrote above, this needs a big correction. The essence that they share is the fullness of deity.
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  13. M-theory

    M-theory Saint Esprit

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    You call it a clever loophole. The way I look at it, I don't see any loophole OUT of it. I've tried to look into what possible alternatives there may or may not be.
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  14. reggie_jax

    reggie_jax rapper noyd

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    i think i might sort of get it now, still might be a little confused. and to answer you other post about me knowing more about it than before, i actually read over the wiki article on it, but my first post was legit that was before i read anything about it.

    here's my understanding. jesus wasn't really created in essence, but he was begotten of god. or not god, cause he IS god, so he's begotten of the father. and who is the father? he's god, but so is jesus. and the holy spirit, who proceeds from the father but is not begotten.

    this narrative seems to suggest that the father is sort of the central figure who was responsible for both jesus and the holy spirit, like they exist through him, like he was the one jewish 'god' that existed prior to the new testament.

    from some of the quotes about the holy spirit it almost sounds like a metaphor for preaching and worship. so god (the father) puts himself into a child and gets jesus, and puts his spirit into the people and gets the holy spirit or people's worship which helps to spread the word.

    or am i off?
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  15. SpillnMoney

    SpillnMoney Member

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    and God said let US make man in OUR own image. US was actually refering to all 3.
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  16. TheBigPayback

    TheBigPayback God Particle

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    Since we are only privied to events back to "creation" we have no idea what happen b4 that except parts of the bible that talks about the angels downfall. As far as we know though all 3 have been around at least since creation.
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