Discussion in 'The R&B Haven' started by Jai-Z, Jun 23, 2007.
What's the distinction between 'better vocal performer' and 'more vocal ability'?
^I think the difference is potential.
I don't know... I'm kinda confused myself. Ixtlan be throwing some phrases out there.
Aaliyah is much more dynamic than Ciara.
Stronger, richer tone. Better projection.
Likely the product of good voice coaching.
Ciara has more raw vocal talent.
Put simply, a better vocal instrument.
More elasticity. Better range. Better improvisation.
Can produce riffs a bit more effortlessly. Better control.
Ciara's achilles heel is that she's not a strong vocalist.
If she were this wouldn't be debatable.
What I observed in those videos was a more seasoned performer in Aaliyah. Comfortable, confident and well trained. Remember, her Star Search appearance came at just 11 years of age.
Ciara doesn't have that background. And I'd venture to guess that she hasn't had the training either.
On the whole Aaliyah's clearly a better performer and artist.
Ciara's a better dancer and has the most vocal ability of the two...
yea.. just what i thought.. u not only need ur ears checked.. but ur mind too. u kno nothing about singing.lol
ciara has no raw vocal talent. i'll give u the perfect example of raw vocal talent.. jordin sparks from american idol. THAT IS raw vocal talent. are u really that dingy?? seriously??
ciara can not.. sing better than aaliyah. her vocals are all over the place.. all the time. not too mention very fragile. she can not project a note.. worth shit.. with out being outta tune.
u really must have not listened to the evidence.
this wouldnt be debatible if ciara had chops?? are u kidding me?? lol let me break it down to u..
lets say ciara did have strength in her voice.. to hold 1 note. she still wouldnt match aaliyah. cause aaliyah did have some strength... but shes a 2nd soprano, its not as noticeable as a alto.. bcus there voice is so light and altos r alot deeper and solid. aaliyah was a second seprano.. so no her voice is not going to match beyonce.. bcus beyonce is an alto. so.. u cant compare altos with sopranos. thats 2 totally different things. and no.. she didnt have the chance to have the success beyonce is having.. she died b4 it even really began. do u kno what range is? something ciara doesnt have. all her notes are pretty close to the same pitch.. all the time.lol altho power does not equal vocal range.. its still something ciara has neither of.
strength aka vocal power = the ability to belt out a strong note and hold it.
riffs aka runs = the ability to go up and down the scales in a bar etc..
ciara never does that.lol wtf?
aaliyah cant do the runs ciara does? do u even listen to their music?? no.. wait.. let me rephrase.. do u even hear them sing.. behind those good beats?? i think the good beats drown them out for u.. cus ur not listening to them sing.
u kno nothing about singing.
if you dont believe ciara had a vocal coach. u must b blind. ciara's vocal coach was coaching her while she was practicing b4 her performance.. at her concert. in the 3rd video. so dont gmme that. theres a clip of both of them singn acapella.. LIVE to prove u werent listening.
and please dont let me start with the dancing.. u cant compare 2004-2007 dances.. with 1996-2001 dances. come on man. dances change and get tired every month. besides... a good 75% of ciars dances are booty poppn and hip swerving.. (at which she bit from aaliyah). i dare u to say she didnt. cus no1 was doing that when aaliyah was doing it.
what the fuck? Beyonce didn't take off until Aaliyah died and we needed another talent to come along and take her place. Destiny's Child was doing their thing but Aaliyah was the deal. This is not bias for Aaliyah...it's just how it was.
You might not have been around at the height of Aaliyah's popularity or remember because she was clearly the most beautiful. Her only competition at the time was JLO and she was second to JLO.
Aaliyah then cut the deck....Brandy, Monica, Destiny's Child? Hell no. Check that video when they were together on the Red Carpet....Aaliyah on the red carpet and Beyonce nobody even really knew like that hosting not even talked about.
Aaliyah was the definition of sexy what the hell are you talking about?
you can't be serious! I'll give you the worldwide part...Aaliyah MAY not have had that at the time she died (I'm not sure about that one) but best believe after the MATRIX sequels she was going to have that.
Romeo Must Die wasn't a failure but it wasn't really a success either, But her soundtrack song TRY AGAIN was a success a very big one.
that shit made no sense.
Ciara doesn't have more raw talent than Aaliyah.
Aaliyah was singing with Gladys Knight at a young age, I'm sure Gladys knows who has raw talent. R Kelly saw she could sing, Timbaland and Missy Elliott recognized she could sing, She was nominated for an Oscar award for a soundtrack song, only the best get nominated for that shit.
She's more seasoned performer because she's a better singer...It's more natural for her to sing in front of people. She had a better voice...period. As proof she can cover an Isley Brother's no problem....Ciara can't do that...she is unable to
I love Ciara, really I do, but her voice is not angelic, it's not all that, it's serviceable and with the right songs (Promise) can sound really good and with the wrong songs can sound very bad.
imma have to go with aaliyah she was badass
I don't know how people can genuinely argue that Aaliyah's star shined as bright as Beyonce's is right now. That's crazy to me.
I liked Aaliyah, but for anyone to say that she had more universal appeal now than Beyonce has had for the last three years is.....almost shocking to me.
when they were both out was what i was talking about.... Aaliyah's star very much outshined Beyonce and Destiny's Child from 1997 - 2001. If you don't believe that then I don't know what to tell ya.
If you think Beyonce is the shit now....imagine what Aaliyah would have been had she not died. She was already a major star, movies, modeling, dancing, platinum sales, number one hits, magazine covers, trendsetter etc. Beyonce' before Beyonce' was Beyonce'. It's not that hard to understand.
According to whom? The person I'm arguing against?
You're the arbiter of who is knowledgeable and who isn't?
No... I think what you wanted to say is that you disagree.
Argue against the argument and not against the person.
Sparks is one of the least talented AI winners in the history of that competition.
She's forgettable and won't make a lasting impression in the music industry.
Check the date... Write it down. I said it first.
That competition is on the decline.
Until they go back to a more thorough screening process the talent pool will continue to suffer and you'll get watered down finalists and winners.
We can agree to disagree (though I did state clearly that Ciara does have fragile vocals myself).
The fact that they sing in different registers hardly means they can't be compared vocally.
She would never have been as big a star as Beyonce had become.
You have no evidence to support such a claim. I do think she was headed towards more commercial success, but I doubt seriously that she would be as bright a star.
She has nothing at all on Beyonce vocally.
More film exposure would've helped her star to burn brighter, but she simply would never have been Beyonce.
Which honestly is insignificant.
What she would've been is beloved among Black folks and likely an artist who would be remembered down the line. Much more important.
Apparently you've never heard "And I".
Here's what you fail to realize... I'm a much bigger fan of Aaliyah than I am of Ciara. I'm still warming up to Ciara. Kon can tell you I didn't think the girl could sing at all until I heard "And I". Her material simply hasn't shown her range. Because she's following an industry formula.
Case in point...
Cassie... Rumored to have a three-octave range, but you'd never know it by listening to her material.
At the end of the day...
Neither Aaliyah or Ciara were/are great vocalists.
They're average at best.
The argument, essentially, is what would you rather eat for dinner...
Grilled Cheese or Peanut Butter & Jelly. Sure one may be better than the other, but neither is steak and potatoes.
Again, we can agree to disagree.
I'm sure I would've been onstage with Gladys too if she were my aunt.
Aaliyah at her best was still inferior to other artists in her prime.
She had nothing at all on Brandy or Monica or a half-dozen other artists you can name.
Hell even if I conceded that she was a better vocalist than Ciara that's STILL not saying much.
Aaliyah was largely a product of Timbaland, just like Ginuwine, just like Missy Elliot, just like the new Justin Timberlake. I think I've heard Ciara maybe once or twice, and, well, meh. Neither one is particularly impressive.
I'll say it again... Aaliyah is highly revered now because she was "beautiful" and deceased.
I think she was still beloved Kon, but I do think that she's gained a bit more respect posthumously that she didn't have when she was alive.
Remember... She was an artist who hadn't quite crossed over that consistently sold 2-3 million albums.
I would have to say Aaliyah.
I think Aaliyah was solid long before ever pairing up with Timbaland.
Her first album was illy.
you were obviously too young to remember her
her first two albums were multiplatinum before she died, the third one was on its way to multiplatinum
^^ what he said and what you said are almost the same thing.
Maybe, but without Timbo she would've languished. Are You That Somebody was EVERYWHERE.
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